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I just picked up an 809 that looks complete.  It lit up but thats all.  First thing i did was free up the air piston...learned that from my e1000.  I have no keys, so i took off the door lock stuff.  It lights up, but only a few things on the front door, nothing up top, the coin things on the door seem to make something make noise.  Im not used to this type of machine, any idea what to look for first? I have no books or diagrams for em machines.

Thanks for any help.

Push down on the coin switch on your door & listen if anything happens.  Are insert coin, coin accepted or winner paid lights on?  If not, and there are no lights on the top unit, check your fuses.
Pull out all your subunits and check the switches to be sure they open and close.  Lube anything mechanical that appears sticky or binding. 
Look for loose or unattached wires and bad solder joints.  Read the post on using jumpers (in electromechanicals) to be able to check your lights and coils to see if they're working.
Let us know what kinds of things aren't working.  Send pics.
See if it takes coins.
read post on how to get free handle pull if it doesn't.
Play around with it.
Cool.

Thanks for the rely.  The only lights that come is the flouresent belly light, 2 bulbs on the right side of the door brightly, 2 lights on the left of the door dimly.  When triggering the coin in switch, there is a clicking from the top of the machine...a counter of somekind like a pinball reel score.  When i trigger the payout switch a counter by the reels tallys, when i do this and have the door switch closed, another counter tallys paid out.  Thats all I got.  I read about the jumpers....confused, jump the colors mentioned to what?  No one has a download of this book by mead?  Thanks

Acouple more lights i forgot about the light over the payout tray works as does the call attendant light will flash.

door pic, all fuses good

Check your door carefully to see if any of the bulb tabs are touching to case.
Pull out the top unit and check it out. make sure units step up and reset mechanically.  Look for bad switches while you're there.
Read as many posts on EM's as you have time for, a lot of info on there.........
If you can find your trip relay (coin relay assembly) on the lower left side of the reel mech, trip it, and then put reel assembly back in and see if the handle pulls.
If not, read section on how to get free handle pulls, (EM section) and play the machine for awhile.
Sometimes after you loosen it up like that it'll start behaving.
Off to dinner with sweetie, talk later....

With the Bally EM slots the first thing I do is to clean the contacts on the blade switchs. I like to use a small folded piece of paper and rubbing alcohol. Never sand or file the contacts. I also like to test there operation with my OHM meter. Sometimes they look to be making contact but you meter will tell you other wise. Just like the later Bally E-Series slots, you need to make sure everything is oiled and moving nice and free. These early Bally EM machines need to be played regularly to keep them working. If you let them sit then the contact lose it.

This machine looks familiar! It looks like my machine other than there's bars where all my melons are. I'll be following this thread. You've got the BEST help with you.  :3-

Thanks for the posts.  I put the handle into free play.  The reel assembly looks to be working properly, spins, stops.  Many pulls.  The machine is not powering up completely...The coils for the coin slot and coin diverter to not energize, only basic lights on door.  I guess to go any farther i will clean all contacts as suggested, I thought there would be something else to look at as far as the power goes.  I like how the e series have the test points...nothing like that on here i guess.  Seems like a good project while the race is on sunday. Thanks

check your 50V fuse, the one with the orange wires.  That runs all your coils and solenoids.
http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=17550.0 (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=17550.0)
http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=17558.0 (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=17558.0)
http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=17559.0 (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=17559.0)
Some misc links for you to follow.
Most things on the EMs can be repaired, no chips to blow up, etc.  Love them.

One thing to check that can cause a problem on the EM slot are the Beau plugs that connect the hopper to the cabinet and the reel assembly to the cabinet. They can have corrosion or  become damaged. I have sprayed them with WD40 in the past and then worked the hopper and reel plug by sliding them together and taking them apart 4-5-6 times.. When done wipe them down to clean off any over spray.. Doing this will sometime clean the plug and help with connection issues..

I have cleaned all of the contacts.   I have also lubed the mechanisims.  Now i have the 1st coin in light on the top of the machine.  Still there is no power going to the coils on the door.  I need to find out where this power comes from and test from there.  There is a transformer in the left rear.....any ideas where to to test the outputs/inputs to it? I have the mead book on its way, it should help.  Thanks

Power comes from the transformer, through your fuses.  Did you check your 50V fuse? That runs all your coils....

Sorry, I see in one of your posts you say the fuses are good.  Never mind.
Put your meter on 50VDC, and check power at several locations throughout the machine.
You should read 50V between solid orange wires and solid yellow wires.  Also, you should read 6V between solid blue wires and solid yellow.
See where you have these voltages, and where you don't.  You can also check these same wires on the transformer, and at your fuses, as well as on the door (the lockout coil behind your coin acceptor).
Push down on the bowl of your hopper and see if it activates or deactivates your coin diverter coil and flap on the door.
Release your coin relay assembly (in a prior post), put back in the reel mech, and try the coin switch to see if you get odds step up.
The key to knowing if you have 50V is if you hear anything when you push the coin in switch.
Note, not all coils are 50V.  You have one in the front of the hopper, and probably that one on the door are 120V so be careful around them.

Thanks for the tips.....I checked the orange to yellow wires right at the transformer, they are right next to each other.   There was no voltage between them.  I then checked resistance between them....it is open....that would leave me to believe that the transformer is bad?  Thanks for any tips on the next move.

I don't know how well you use your VOM, but I assume power was on and the machine was lit up when you checked for voltage?
And hopefully also, that power was NOT on when you measured resistance?
Try measuring voltage between yellow and Blue.
Also, for giggles check voltage between orange and blue, it should measure somewhere around 57V.


ALSO, my error, YOU SHOULD BE READING VOLTS ON THE AC SCALE..., this is an AC machine, very sorry about that. Haven't had enough coffee yet today.

so all readings are acv or dcv?   Dont confuse me...lol

ACV.  Again, my error.  It's an AC machine.

heres the readings from the transformer.....
orange/yellow   53

yellow blue   6.5

orange/blue    60

while trying to figure out the electrical issue i cleaned the case....these things really shine up nice.  :3-

Sounds good!!!
Now you might want to use your ohms scale, with power off, and check continuity along your orange wire, wherever you find it on the machine.
Should be going to your door, maybe the top unit, the reels, and hopper, handle, etc.
Look at the plugs (for example your reel mech, pull it out and look to see where the orange wire goes and then check the MACHINE plug side to verify you have continuity.  You can use a paperclip on the female plug side of your harness.
Clip on to the orange on your transformer, and see where it is good, and where it is missing.
If none of your coils are working, it is probably a missing 50V feed (orange wire) in my opinion.
But I am often wrong.  At least this will give you something to work on, and also get you more familiar with your machine.
Good job!

quik test ....orange continuity from transformer to ....hopper....coin in switch on door

update ...new door lock installed...no difference with dooor actually closed and locked.....I have continuity fro transformer orange to upper machine case orange.  Those plugs are kinda loose...how reliable are these molex connections?

They're generally ok, but you can often spread the Male pins a little bit to get better contact.
You might as well check all your bulbs, since you have a meter, and replace those that are bad.
You need a starter for your belly glass, but you can swap them out after the machine is powered up to get it lit.
You can check all your coils with 2 jumpers, and that will ensure that they are all working.
Clip onto yellow on transformer, and then orange with the other one, and then clip orange on to each coil (to the orange wire...duh) then touch the yellow jumper to see if your coils are working. You can do this without units in the machine if your jumpers are long enough. If your coils are all good, then we seem to have a break in the 50V feed somewhere I'm thinking.
As long as I'm here, I'll keep at it to help you get machine working.  I do appreciate your energy and enthusiasm to fix it.
That's pretty cool.
Perhaps others can chime in with suggestions.
Keep checking continuity on your orange (50V wires) and see where you are missing it. 
Again, checking with jumpers will eliminate coil problems and help with diagnosis....
good job!  We'll figure it out.

thanks for the help oldreno.....I am new to these but really like it.  will get more info soon......any others feel free to give advise.

OldReno, if you go back and look at the pic in post #4, the Blue wire on the winner paid light looks dark like its been hot, the one just above the top molex plug.. They have black tape covering the socket too? I wonder if there was a problem at one time with that socket?? It also looks like the wires bundle where the door closes has been re-taped at sometime by the top door hinge. Could be covering up a repair or damage?

Gary

Thanks...i double checked that area, and do not see any discoloration, th e tape is on a metal part so the wires do not get sliced.  I guess i have to take the coils out of the door to test as jumpers dont seem to get to them so easily.  Its gotta be something small....everything looks like it should work, nothing looks rigged up, and the fuses are good and the power readings at the transformer are right on.  I ve got to be overlooking something.

Poof, you're going to find that working on them is much more fun than playing them.
So you have no coils at all activating when you push down on the coin in switch?
Once again, release your coin relay latch (left side of reel mech), push back in reels, and try the coin in switch again.
Also, try pulling out the top unit, and mechanically step up the odds disc.  Re-assemble, and try the coin in switch again. Just to see if it resets the odds.
Since you have your meter out, why not check the coin switch posts for continuity.  2 checks, norm open and norm closed side.
Eventually you're going to track this down, you know....
Yes, I'm having fun too.
Also, find a solid orange and a solid yellow on the door, and see if you read any voltages there.  Generally you can use yellow of coin in switch, and orange behind the coin acceptor (the lockout coil)  BTW, lockout should be on anytime you're in idle state.  Unless it's a dollar machine.

PROGRESS MADE......I gues i missed the coil latch on the side of the reels before.  Sorry.  So i reset the latch......jumped yellow from transformer to the coul behind the coin mech, and it engaged, while holding jumped power, i moved the coin in switch, and the upper lights moved and clicked all the way to 5 coins in,  then i could pull the handle and the reels did there deal.   I tried to jump the lower coin diverter coil with orange from trans and nothing happened (it has just orange a grey wires, as well as the coil by the door lock area).

     I dont know what this means or proves, but it is going in the right direction....missing a yellow continuity somewhere??????

Be careful with those jumpers.  If you have 50V, then you don't need the orange wire poking around.
Check all your switches on the coin relay assembly, and then also on the handle release assembly.
Back later, day with my sweetie....
Be careful.  If you have 50V then you only need the yellow to engage the coils.  All switches come from yellow eventually, and you are just bypassing them with the yellow.  Find the bad switches, and clean and adjust them.

When you push down on the coin-in switch, it releases the coin relay assembly.  One of those assembly switches is normally open, and it goes to the handle release coil.  When you release the coin-in switch, it provides power through that coin relay switch (to the handle), and releases the handle.  (Also the odds reset at the same time)
That's how it works,
downstroke trips coin relay,
upstroke releases handle.
If you don't get coin relay to trip, you'll never get handle release.
Coin relay tripping also lights up the coin accepted light, so you can tell from outside the machine if it's tripped or not.

no progress, have ordered the mead em book, waiting for its arrival to get this thing licked.  While waiting picked up an old rock ola juke box 1965, got it working already!

ok, I have the mead book.  Im not sure if it is helping any.  Kinda giving up, I dont know what to do next.

OldReno is having trouble with his ISP, and hasn't been here. Hopefully he'll be back SOON.
HANG IN THERE. I'm having continued trouble with my exact same model: 809. I think both of us may be having multiple issues. The key is just making even a little progress. The other good thing is that once these beasts work, you keep playing with them and they'll go forever. I have a Bally 1114 and it's been working for well over 13 years now (two girlfriends ago!) and still going strong.
I'd recommend just reading through some of the operational information from the Mead book. Even if it isn't directly related there will be a point where things will start to "click." I'm still very frustrated with mine, which is having intermittent problems. I can't get it to "stay broken." Half the time, it pays out properly, then it overpays, then it underpays.
Try wine.  :140-
All kidding aside (which is hard for me to do sometimes) just throw a towel over it and read the book at your pace and just come back to it when you are ready. Mine has sat in the garage for a month now and I'm ready to get back to it soon.
Hope this helps and REALLY HOPE we hear from Craig soon!

Hi Poof,
somehow the internet is working again and I can log on NLG.
Ok, let's start over.
What is it doing?
What is it not doing.
Bring me up to speed.

Glad your back old reno!   I plug it in and it all ights up.  no insert coin on the door light.  I remove coin mec and jump yellow to coil behind coin mech, i can then manually engauge that arm and pull the reel handle and it does its thing.  The coin in on the door never lights, but the multiplyer up top does acknowledge and will progress with multiple manual strike to coin in arm. All wires on door look factory and i have continuity from yellow coil coin to the plug on door....all fuses are good.  Gotta be something small?

Put a jumper on the NON-Blue side of one of your working 6V door lights, and touch the other end to the NON Blue side of your insert coin light.  Should go on.  If so, check your N.O. payout relay switches, and your switches on the odds unit that are moved by that little tab on the white gear up there. Look for one that only opens after the last step of the odds unit.
Can you coin the machine without jumping that coil on the door?  You are speaking of the coin lockout coil behind the acceptor?  Does it work if you don't jump it?  If not, try pulling on the pump arm on the right side of the reels, and tug it towards you to see if that energizes it.
Everything else ok?
Send a pic of how you jump that coil....

Sorry its been some time...almost ready to give this deal up.  I jumped from the non blue side of a working door light to the non blue of the coin in and insert coin lights....they did light up.  I am jumping straight from the yellow side of the transformer to the yellow side of the coil behind the coin acceptor.   When i do this, and manually trigger the coin in arm, it will coin up...all the way to 5 coins, and i can pull the handle and it seems to operate fine.  I havent had a payout to know if that part works, or even will with the door open.

Any help would be appreciated.  I dont want to give up on it, thats not really me.  But its a pretty big paperweght the way it is now.

Post a pic of what coil it is that you're jumping the yellow wire to.
So, get me up to speed on this again.
When you push down on the coin switch, do you hear anything happen?  does the coin relay trip (left side of reels on the bottom in the back.
We can get to your non working lights later, does the machine work otherwise?
Did you check all the switches on your coin relay?
I don't have time right now to read the whole post over, let's start from scratch.

I guess the only thing Ithat doesnt work is the coil behind the coin accepter and the insert coin and the coin accepted light on door.  It powers up , lights come on door and up top.  If i put a coin in, itstays in the acceptor unless i press coin return.  Now, if i move the arm of the lever behind the acceptor, the coin does what it is supposed to and hits the coin in arm, and the upper portion coins up, but you cant pull handle..   the coin relay does not trip.   

Now, if i remove the coin acceptor and power the coil behind it, you can hear the coin relay back by the reels trip.  Then i can depress the coin in arm and coin up the top of machine and pull the handle and all seems to  work fine.

It seems like we need to figure out why coils and lights in the door and the relay by the reels is not geting power?

Thanks for your help sir.

Try carefully putting a paperclip onto your dashpot switch to hold it together, and gently slide the reel mech back in and try it again.  Make sure it doesn't short anything out.

That's really odd.... Shorting that coil shouldn't give handle release.  Hummmmm....

There's only a couple of switches in the circuit to the coin relay, one of them is on the coin relay stack itself, should be normally closed, and goes to the coin relay coil itself....  The other one I believe is on the handle release switches stack.  Check all those switches.
did you check machine carefully for shorts?
Keep at it, we'll be here.

Ok,  I decided to run the jumper wire and close the door and see if the rest works properly.  It spins fine, but the reel closest to the handle seems to be off a bit to the pay line, so i dont know if the payout portion works.  How do you align the reels? 

Thanks

Set your 3 reels up to the highest pay on centerline.  You might see that they are all the deepest cuts of the reel disc. If so, then make sure your 3rd reel is also in the deepest cut.
Then look at reel #3 and see how far off your top award pay is.  You may have to move the reel strip up or down to get it on centerline.
It should pay when you gently slide the reel mech back in.

Thanks.   I did alighn the reel, and did move the strip a little to get the visual correct.  No pay.  I played the machine jumped and no pays at all.  Kinda figured this was the case.  Have to find out why no power to certain parts of the machine. 

What is an average price for one of these machines working?  I'm in Fl, so they probably not as prevelent as in the west.  Or how about not quite working?  lol   Thanks

Check all your pays, and tell us what it pays on and what it does not pay on....
So, does the machine work OK now, except for pays????

Hi,   It seems like it doesnt pay at all, like there is no power to that area of the machine.   Is there a way to test the hopper pull out?   


I have the coil on the door jumped.  Most lights on door are on...no reel light, coin accepted, or insert coin light.

With door closed, I play coins, and the upper section lights up, coin in up to 5, and i can pull handle.  The reels are aligned, and there is no other noise or action from the machine, even when there should be a pay.

This thing is frustrateing

Did this stuff work before you jumpered the coil?

No, before the coil jump, same lights everywhere, but could not pull handle.

Undo jumper.
Read ALL posts in this thread, and check ALL suggestions, in order.
Do you have a meter?
Did you check for shorts?
Have you checked all switches?

XOXOXO
PM me if you need to.

Just ran across this thread by accident.  Most of his symptoms were the same as the one on my 809 that you guys helped me with.  Base problems with my 809 were the fact that the beau plug for the coin hopper in the cabinet did not line up with the one on the coin hopper. Someone apparently loosened the screws on the one in the cabinet, reached around the coin hopper, and plugged it in manually.  First time someone unplugged the coin hopper, nothing worked anymore.
Other problem was that the coin mechanism didn't really fit the machine, so (the same??) someone bent the tab out of the way and cut a wire in the feature unit that normally operated the various relays and lights.  After I located the cut wire and replaced it, and found a correct coin mech, everything worked great!

Of course, I had to clean a couple hundred contacts in the middle of all of this diagnosis!

Perhaps the "someone" who worked on my machine also worked on his!!

Dave E

I just purchased this machine from poof, didn't know until now.  Removed the jumper from transformer to coin mech., installed a few light bulbs, cleaned a bunch of contacts, changed position of door lock, and now everything works with the exception of no pay on cherry or two cherrys.  When a cherry payout appears on the reel assy., it just acts like nopay.  If I move the first reel down just a bit, pays out fine.  So now I'll do a little wiper arm adjustment and see if it helps.

Ron

Mine had one extremely ornery set of contacts on a relay that refused to clean with "normal" (non-abrasive) methods.  By using the book, I finally traced the circuitry down to a particular set of contacts, and found via a meter that they were physically closed, but not making electrical contact.  Cleaned them using a points file with the cleaner, and a whole bunch of stuff worked that didn't before!

The book that I purchased is published by Liberty Bell Books.  I was initially kinda disappointed in the fact that the book was so "general" in nature until I found out how many different varieties of these machines there are!  They're all similar in operation, but vary widely in their individual construction and operation.  Once I realized that the purpose of the book is more to "steer me in the right direction" rather than "solving a problem", I had no problem using the book, along with basic electronic troubleshooting skills, to work out the various problems in my machine.  My biggest problem was the "work" that had been done by others prior to my getting this machine.

Mine still has a minor problem similar to the one you described above - every now and then, the machine will not pay out when a single cherry is hit.  I'm sure it's a contact problem in the reel assembly, but it happens so seldom that I've just been too lazy to pull the reel unit out and find it.

Good luck with your final problem.

Dave E 

Update...

Problem solved on the no cherry payout.  It was the zero stop on the coin hopper.  Rubber is deterorating and needs replacement.  I think I read somewhere that you can use a pencil erasure.  Checked all payouts and they work.  Now, the machine just needs some door adjustments and a few light sockets. 

Ain't it fun when you finally get all the demons out??!!
Dave E
 :71-

It sure is.  Now just need to keep it going.