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Title: Explanation of battery usage with slot CMOS Post by: StatFreak on September 21, 2008, 02:36:52 AM StatFreak
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2007, 06:49:40 PM » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (Regarding a Universal Nicad battery) I'm wondering if the battery could be replaced with the Lithium Ion batteries that the IGT S+ and Bally Pro-Slot machines use? They are 3.6v, and there are two versions. 1/2AA (looks kind of barrel-ish) and full AA. The full AA has more mAh's so would last longer. While these are not listed as rechargeable, I have to wonder what goes on in the circuits of these machines, because my IGTs NEVER die, and I have had to replace the Ballys twice already. What I found is that if I turn on the Ballys on a regular basis and leave them on for a day or so, this seems to prolong the battery life (haven't had to change it since starting this procedure). As I said, they aren't officially rechargeable. Cactusjack « Reply #16 on: September 12, 2007, 01:00:08 PM » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To respond to your original question - What's going on? You have to remember how a slot is typically operated. They are on 24/7 or in worst case, on for 12 hours, off for 12 hours etc. Therefore, there is little reason for the machine to be able to hold its memory for anything other than the typicall power outtage or when a board is out for service. If a machine is retired, and warehoused, there is no one who cares if all the Acounting data or settings are lost, other than the re-seller - which is not who the machines are designed and built for. Lithium Batteries are not designed to put out a lot of current. But they can put out a small amount of power for a long time. In the case of coin or watch batteries, there are even two types. Ones who's part numbers start with CR and those that start with BR. One is designed to deliver higher amounts of power in bursts (IR remotes etc.) The other is designed to provide a small amout of contiuous power for long periods of time (memory retention.) Nicads, as you know, are rechargable and often, can deliver more current than a lithium battery can. Where the difference lies is in the CMOS ram chips these batteries are there to power. If you are using a Lithium cell as battery back up, it will be necessary to pick a CMOS RAM that is listed as VERY LOW power or LL or Ultra Low Power. This means, the CMOS ram, in standby (power off) will use very little current - usually in the micro amps instead of milli-amps. Lower power CMOS is just memory that does use much power when operating. But LL parts are designed for memory retention with battery power. Since the Nicad is rechargeable, it gets continuously charged while the machine is on. If the machine isn't going to be powered down more than lets say, 30 days, then the higher priced LL CMOS does not need to be used (probably what Bally did). But also remember, that NICAD batteries are typically - "Trickle Charged" and it may take hours for the cell to reach a full charge. So, turning a home slot on for an hour or two and then having it off for the rest of the day, results in less than necessary charging time. So, each day, it gets weaker and weaker. To add to this, different Low Power CMOS ram have different ratings as to their DATA RETENTION. In other words, some will hold their data down to 3 volts, while others, are guaranteed to hold it down to 2 volts. So, when using a 3.6V cell, this provides more discharge time than with a 3 volt RAM. So, lets say a typical CMOS ram uses 5ma in standby, a 150ma (which is the typicall rating of three 1/3 AA cell 3.6v) Nicad Batttery will power it for 30 hours on a full charge. The LL RAM may only use 100ua. CJ Title: Re: Explanation of battery usage with slot CMOS Post by: Thor777 on September 21, 2008, 02:42:55 AM StatFreak « Reply #11 on: January 31, 2007, 06:49:40 PM » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (Regarding a Universal Nicad battery) I'm wondering if the battery could be replaced with the Lithium Ion batteries that the IGT S+ and Bally Pro-Slot machines use? They are 3.6v, and there are two versions. 1/2AA (looks kind of barrel-ish) and full AA. The full AA has more mAh's so would last longer. While these are not listed as rechargeable, I have to wonder what goes on in the circuits of these machines, because my IGTs NEVER die, and I have had to replace the Ballys twice already. What I found is that if I turn on the Ballys on a regular basis and leave them on for a day or so, this seems to prolong the battery life (haven't had to change it since starting this procedure). As I said, they aren't officially rechargeable. Cactusjack « Reply #16 on: September 12, 2007, 01:00:08 PM » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To respond to your original question - What's going on? You have to remember how a slot is typically operated. They are on 24/7 or in worst case, on for 12 hours, off for 12 hours etc. Therefore, there is little reason for the machine to be able to hold its memory for anything other than the typicall power outtage or when a board is out for service. If a machine is retired, and warehoused, there is no one who cares if all the Acounting data or settings are lost, other than the re-seller - which is not who the machines are designed and built for. Lithium Batteries are not designed to put out a lot of current. But they can put out a small amount of power for a long time. In the case of coin or watch batteries, there are even two types. Ones who's part numbers start with CR and those that start with BR. One is designed to deliver higher amounts of power in bursts (IR remotes etc.) The other is designed to provide a small amout of contiuous power for long periods of time (memory retention.) Nicads, as you know, are rechargable and often, can deliver more current than a lithium battery can. Where the difference lies is in the CMOS ram chips these batteries are there to power. If you are using a Lithium cell as battery back up, it will be necessary to pick a CMOS RAM that is listed as VERY LOW power or LL or Ultra Low Power. This means, the CMOS ram, in standby (power off) will use very little current - usually in the micro amps instead of milli-amps. Lower power CMOS is just memory that does use much power when operating. But LL parts are designed for memory retention with battery power. Since the Nicad is rechargeable, it gets continuously charged while the machine is on. If the machine isn't going to be powered down more than lets say, 30 days, then the higher priced LL CMOS does not need to be used (probably what Bally did). But also remember, that NICAD batteries are typically - "Trickle Charged" and it may take hours for the cell to reach a full charge. So, turning a home slot on for an hour or two and then having it off for the rest of the day, results in less than necessary charging time. So, each day, it gets weaker and weaker. To add to this, different Low Power CMOS ram have different ratings as to their DATA RETENTION. In other words, some will hold their data down to 3 volts, while others, are guaranteed to hold it down to 2 volts. So, when using a 3.6V cell, this provides more discharge time than with a 3 volt RAM. So, lets say a typical CMOS ram uses 5ma in standby, a 150ma (which is the typicall rating of three 1/3 AA cell 3.6v) Nicad Batttery will power it for 30 hours on a full charge. The LL RAM may only use 100ua. CJ VERY NICE EXPLANATION SATFREAK...THANKS |