New Life Games Tech Forums

So I thought I'd share my experience with Error 12 codes on my Jackpot Jungle S Machine.

Some of you know that my machine has a 3 AA battery pack installed instead of the factory battery.  Over the past couple of weeks, I started getting random 12 errors for no rhyme or reason.  When it first started, I figured the batteries were low, so I changed them out.  With new Duracell batteries and hours later, BOOM error 12.  I checked the EPROM's again.  A week ago I found one of them had a bent pin.  Fixed that problem and reinstalled, but no help with the 12 codes.  Then I thought maybe I had a wiring issue with the new buttons that I had installed.  Checked, rechecked, and even put the old buttons back on...no change.  The game might work for hours, or minutes...no pattern at all.  Sometimes when the game was set to pay coins it would play fine until the hopper started to pay coins.  X amount of coins into the payout process it would seize up and bomb out with a 12 code.  I noticed that the power cord was frayed a bit, so I replaced with a PC power cord...worked for a while and then bombed out with a 12 code.  

 :25- :37-

Something was shorting out somewhere....obviously.  Finally, I decided to take the motherboard completely out and after looking closely at the solder job for the battery pack that the previous owner had installed, it looked like the positive lead was a bit loose, but not enough to make a difference.  At any rate, I was desperate, so I resoldered both the positive and negative points.  Reinstalled everything and it is now on day 4 without a single problem!  WOOHOO!!  My machine is working perfect now!   :3-  Hope this helps somebody somewhere.

Soldering is an art, if you get it right, it fixes a lot! K+

Great catch!  Sounds like the battery pack was intermittent with those loose wires.  Did you happen to probe the voltage on the board, and if so, did you see anything strange before the repair job?

Do the batteries power the ram all the time, or are they just back up for when the plug is pulled?

Cheers,
-Greg

I wish I knew how to use a volt meter.  I don't own one and don't even know what or how to check anything even if I had one.  From what I've learned from the veterans out here, my understanding is that the batteries get hit the hardest when the machine is off to keep the memory in tact.  When it's powered on, I'm not sure how hard the batteries are hit, but I think it's less compared to when the machine is off.  Perhaps I'm wrong.  Maybe someone else will chime in.

Radio shack has a decent one for $19.95.  (Model: 22-810)  I bet you would find it fairly easy to use, and possibly interesting if you like tinkering.

Cheers,
-Greg

I'm glad you got your machine back on track...but let me ask you a question.
Are you using Lithium batteries in the pack?
They need to be 3.6V total and have a capacity of at least 1.2Ah...   (Ah = Amps per hour)
I'm thinking the pack is too large for the trickle charging system on the MPU.
You are also right about the battery being "engaged" when
the household power plug is pulled out or when the power switch.
The MPU takes cares of the RAM memory while the main power is on and
trickles power to the lithium battery instead.
What I don't know is if the trickle is turned off on the MPU when the battery fully charged or not.

I'm just using regular Duracell batteries.  Should I be using rechargeable AA batteries in this type of battery pack? 

yes Yoeddy1...
Duracell's are NOT rechargeables...
unless you are USING the rechargeable ones...
but make sure they are lithium batteries okay?
Using the wrong chemical makeup uh,....explodes!

The reason I asked about the batteries was because of this thread:

http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=148.msg663#msg663 (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=148.msg663#msg663)

before someone does something stupid!!!!!     Lithium Batteries are NOT NOT NOT NOT rechargeable.( the one that is used in the S+ ) that is why they go out so often.  They have a life expectancy of 5 to 15 years.  If you have any concerns about the type you are using then put the original type  back in and wait for 5years and do it again.  Don't  try to reinvent the wheel!

Jim

oh...umm, okay...I didn't know that lithiums were not rechargeable...
Thanks for letting us know Jim!
A group of us bought a whole boatload of lithiums batteries (3.6V, lithium, 1.2Ah)
Are we using the correct batteries for our S+'s?
I know mine have lasted at least 8 years in a particular S+ in which I have never changed the battery so far.

So are there lithium non-rechargeable AA batteries?

Mark  yes you are using the right ones     google Tadiran.com        they are the people that make the purple battery that is pictured in reply# 6 of this thread.



Jim

The S+ does not recharge batteries, I don't think any slot platform recharges the backup battery (at least none that I've seen).  The batteries as Jim pointed out,  are used while the power is off.  When it's on, the battery is not drained.  If you want to make your life easier, the next time you get an error 12, you can do this easy mod and you'll never have to solder again.

http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=119.0 (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=119.0)

Ok, so Energizer makes a standard lithium (non-rechargeable) AA battery that supposedly lasts 8x longer than a standard AA.  Spendy though, but these should be ok right?

If the error happened while the machine was on, then the batteries should not have been the issue, since the chassis power supply would be powering the ram.  Since an error occurred while the hopper was running, I would suspect the vibration aggravated a cold solder joint.

As for which batteries, you just want to match the original voltage (and something that doesn't leak).

...like the solder joint of the wires from the battery pack to the board.  If the wire became disconnected (or if he removed a battery), I would suspect he'd get an error 12 as the machine would detect a low battery, even if the batteries weren't being used at that moment to keep the memory.

The Universal slots (8116, 8800, 94000) use a rechargable NiCad battery. Not sure if it receives a trickle charge. They seem to last forever but begin leaking acid with age. Best to replace them every five years.

Oops...I added the word lithium to the post above.  Testing them now.  So far so good.

Great yoeddy1 !
By the way, I really like rick hunter's battery mod...I think it's cool! :89-

You know, the more I learn about Uni's the more I think a lot more thought went into their design, makes you wonder why Uni's didn't take hold to the same extent that IGT did.

IGT had a bigger legal department.  Big enough to cause problems for Universal, from what I understand.

Ok...the 12's are coming back on occasion.  It's not related to hopper vibration because sometimes it will bomb out even in credit mode.  I pulled the game chip and memory chip and reseated.  I get the 61 at power up, hold down the test button, and all is well for a while then at random a 12 comes up.  Could it be the molex on the main board?  I'm about ready to just live with it.  I can't think of anything else.

I tried cleaning the molex pins and it didn't change.  I'm thinking of scrapping the battery pack and picking up a 3.6v battery and soldering it onto the board.  Other than trying this, I can't think of anything else.  Anyone?

That's what I would do, however others have faired well with battery packs.

W

Something is causing your battery pack to drain too fast.
I agree with the suggestions made earlier but because
your platform has been known to drain batteries,
I'd go with rick hunter's mod with the purple battery! :89-
uh,....buy a few extra...

Yeah, I guess I'm wondering if the batteries are draining or if something else is shorting out somewhere blitzing my batteries.  Usually a power cycle and/or just opening and closing the door will resolve it.  Could the game chip be bad?  I posted a request for one to try out.

  Why are you wondering if your battery's are draining, take a multimeter and check the voltage, any thing under 3 volts you have a problem. I have never seen a battery recharge it's self,  if it gets low enough to give you a 12  opening and closing the door will not recharge the battery and make the 12 go away. Did you ever have a flashlight that you knew had good battery's but it would not work unless you beat it on something? I think you have a 200 pound flashlight. first thing I would do is either use sandpaper or a file or if your wife isn't looking her finger nail emery board  and clean the ends of the battery's real good. also clean the battery holder terminals.  2nd make sure the wires are soldered on the board real good, only place left is the board plugging into the mother board. I may be wrong but I think you can unplug every connection inside that machine and not get a 12 error. someone please correct me if I'm wrong on that one!  If you  don't have a multimeter?  try Harbor Fright 10296 Fairview Boise not the best meter made, but will get you by, and you will use it more than you think. Damn I'm Windy today,been around Stat to much I guess !!

The game chip would not cause a battery drain situation.  These chips have built-in security, if they are not 100% kosher, you would get an invalid eprom error of some sort.  If the game boots and plays, the chip cannot be bad.

Ok guys.  Here's another piece to the puzzle.  So I go out and purchase a AA 3.6 volt Lithium battery today.  I desolder the battery pack and solder on the new battery.  As I'm plugging in the three connectors back onto the motherboard, I noticed that one of the larger connectors had one pin that was pushed out a bit.  In other words, if this pin was out, I wonder if it was making partial or no contact with the connector.  I grabbed some needle nose pliers and pulled the pin in line with the other ones.  The problem is that I'm not sure if this just happened today or if this is something that I've overlooked in the past.  Guess we'll see.  ;)

At any rate, I guess my solder job worked out.  I've been playing it, power cycling it, and trying to get it to error out with a 12 code...so far so good.  

This AA Lithium battery is a 3.6 volt battery, whereas each of the Lithium batteries in the old pack were rated at 1.5 volts each, giving 4.5 volts.  Is the 4.5 volt pack better under normal circumstances or should it really matter vs. the 3.6 volt single battery that the factory uses?

Btw...there were some brownish hot looking spots on the bottom side of the board, so I'm going to assume that this could ultimately be the problem if the new battery and pin out of alignment doesn't help.  Is it normal after 20 plus years for a board to have brownish spots due to heat and years of play?

Oh yeah,
Brownish spots are basically joules upon joules of heat coming out of various board components...
It's fairly normal...
someday, take the MPU out and look at with a very bright bulb behind it...
You will definitely see brownish spots where the reel resistors are located and
under the big diodes near the capacitors.
That small bunch of 5 resistors are the ones that were "holding/freezing" the reels in place
for years and years in a live 24/7 casino when no one was playing the machine.
The big diodes were fighting all the jolts of electricity struggling to fly backwards...
almost sounds like there was a heavyweight title fight going on while no one was playing...lol

Buzz,

 :208- :208- :208- :208- :208-

I am guessing that it is not a comment about the results of chili or mexican food!!!!

 :31- :73- I could't resist!!!  >:D MADE ME DO IT!!

CH :95-

 :97- :97- :97- :97-



CH :95- --  

:200- :200- :177- :203- :124-

SF :31-

Day 2...so far so good.  In theory, how long should a single Lithium 3.6 volt battery last...if everything is working right?

SF :31-

Somehow I knew I would be getting pie in my face for that one!!! Only problem is that I could not tell what flavor it was!!!  :162- :103- :97-

CH :95-

Jason  look at reply # 9 of this thread and you will have the ans.

That's the beauty of the internet: the pie can be whatever flavor you imagine. Make mine banana cream, chocolate, or chocolate MOOSE (with extra antlers). :30-

Thanks Buzz...it's been troubleshooting mania.  *fingers crossed*

Ok guys...this topic has been to the dead horse saloon, but I just wanted to let everyone know that my game is still running strong and has not errored out once.  It must have had something to do with the previous battery pack that was installed.  Soldering the AA Lithium battery to the contacts on the board seems to have done the trick.

Thanks again for everyone's help.  :)

You have come a long way from wanting to do a hot cut of your batteries as not to loose the configuration....... to soldering onto the board...... good job.....  :50-