Help! IGT S+ doesn't want to take dollar tokens until I feed several through...

[jasonmichael]

OK so I'm new to the board - and I've searched and searched for an answer to the problem I'm having here, to no avail.  I don't know what the proper place to post this is -- I've seen that I'm not supposed to post a question here, but, rather, just research issues -- and, again, I've tried.  So I figured I'd post here and people would let me know where I was supposed to post, and, possibly, I'd get the answer to the problem...  Thanks in advance for your help - much appreciated.

So I have an IGT S plus machine that takes $1 coins.  I got the machine a couple of weeks ago (it's my third IGT S plus - and my first $1 machine) and it worked just fine.  Then, all of a sudden, it stopped accepting $1 coins one night after lots of play.  At the time, the "insert coin" started to flash -- so, I figured I'd run the clear chip, which I did, and, afterwards it worked fine.  Now what's happening is that it works fine -- it accepts cash in the dollar bill validator, puts credits on the machine and can be played with no problem (which leads me to believe it's not a door optics or dollar bill door problem, like I read in the repair logs) -- but, dollar tokens just fall right through the machine.  No more flashing "insert coin," no more zero in the "coins played" window - just regular play with credits or dollars in -- AND - the strange thing is that when the coins drop through, so long as I drop about 30-40 coins through, it starts accepting them with no problem - and will then work regularly for the rest of the night.  Again, my guess from reading repair logs is that the problem, now, is a "rake" problem -- though I don't know exactly what that means just yet.

I took the comparitor out, changed out the coin, everything looks fine (from what I can see), used a compressed air can to blow everything out...but still, sometimes I fire it up and the coins just fall right through.

Any insight folks? 

Thanks, in advance, for your help!

Jason

[knagl]

I've moved this out of the repair logs section and into the S+ section.  We absolutely encourage you to post questions about your machine, just not in the repair logs section of the forum -- that section is for documenting repairs made to a machine, not for asking questions about a machine.

When you say that the $1 coins are "falling through" the machine, are you saying that they're being rejected to the coin tray, or that they're going into the machine but not giving you credit?

If they're being rejected, the first thing to do is to adjust the sensitivity on your coin comparator to make the machine less likely to reject coins.  The following post explains how to do that:

http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=10759.msg93615#msg93615

If they're being accepted by the machine but not giving credit, that's a different issue and we can tackle that from a different approach if that's the issue.

Finally, please don't be eager to use your RAM clear chip.  The clear chip is not the "fix everything" chip, and in reality typically won't help with most S+ machine issues.  Please post here before ever using your clear chip -- we can save you a lot of trouble and headache.

(As far as the insert coin light flashing, some SP chips use that as an indicator that the door was open and is now closed, and the flashing stops after the next paid game has been played.  It's not an indication of an error on those SP chips.)

[jasonmichael]

Thank you for moving this! 

So the coins are just falling through into the tray.  It's not the sensitivity adjustment--some times it takes coins for hours at a time--then others it won't take any.   Right now I put 100 through and nothng.  Other times I'll put ten through and it will start taking them. 

Yikes!

[Buzz]

Jason   

Did all of the tokens your using come from the same mint ?? If your ans. is they came from more than one mint, try sorting them and test the machine using only the tokens exactly like the one in the comparator.If your tokens are all exactly alike I guess were going to have to think this one over a little longer.

[Jim]

one thing to try and that will eliminate everything else EXCEPT the coin comp. On the board directly below the coin comp. there is a tiny white push button, with the door open, push this button, it will put credits on the machine (up to the max bet)  then pull handle game should operate as normal, if this works every time then everything from the coin optics to the CPU board are working and your problem is with the coin comp. and its associated wiring.

The coin comp. works in this fashion: the sample coin you have in the cc establishes a electronic signal, any coins coming into the cc are compared to that signal, if they match,the rake (coil) is pulsed open for a brief moment and the coin is allowed to pass through the cc into the coin optic and establish a credit, if it doesn't match, the rake is NOT pulsed and the coin is sent to the reject path through the cc and is returned to the coin tray.

Sometimes you could lie to the cc and shim out the rake (simulate the rake being pulsed-Opened all the time) if all other circuits are working you should be able to operate and play the game. If this works,then your problem is the cc. 
One other area that could cause the problem you describe, check the wires that plug into the cc, for a dollar cc there should be three wires, sometimes, from being bent and reinserted many times the actual wire is broken inside the insulation and this would cause no voltage getting to the cc and thus it would not work or work intermittently.     

Hope this helps

Jim

[jasonmichael]

-OK so yes, all of the tokens are from the same mint - they're all $1 size Fannini coins. 
-I did the tiny button test and it works fine every time, no problems there.
-Interesting explanation of how the comparitor works - I appreciate it very much.  I hope, one day, to be on your side giving advice and making folks' machines work!
-All wires and all seem to be properly attached and functioning.
-Again, when I turn the machine on it almost always doesn't take coins -- it will take bills, and will play with the tiny button inside -- but I have to feed through anywhere between 10-100 coins before it will warm up to accepting coins.
-I wouldn't mind just changing out the comparitor - they're not too expensive, right?  I've also considered just removing it, and the hopper, altogether, and making it into a "functional piggy bank." 

Any other thoughts Gents?

[jasonmichael]

OK here's something new (and strange...?):  When I fed through a bunch of coins one after the next after the next several at a time, the comparator started clicking audibly in the door.  Click click click click...really fast (but not in perfect time - repeating at different intervals).  What's happening here?  To stop it, I had to power down the machine and fire it back up.  So strange!

[CVslots]

I think you're comparitor is toast. shouldn't be much to replace it, if you can't find one, let me know.

Roz

[Buzz]

Jason  This part on the comparator is called the rake. Fold up a piece of paper and block the rake open and then give the coins a try. Now I must warn you with the rake blocked open any and all coins will go to the hopper.  A mixture of different coins will give you trouble when the hopper tries to pay out,

[knagl]

It's not the sensitivity adjustment--some times it takes coins for hours at a time--then others it won't take any. 

For kicks, please still try adjusting the sensitivity pot as I described in the earlier-linked post.  If that pot gets dirty/oxidized it can give strange results, including rejecting coins for no good reason.  By rotating the pot back and forth a few times before dialing it towards being less sensitive, it'll help to clean the contacts within the pot.  There's really nothing to lose by trying this -- worst case you're going to wind up getting a new comparator anyway, so I'd try this first.

[Neonkiss]

If that doesn't work send me a PM with your address.
I'll send you another dollar compairator, just pay the postage and make a donation to the site if it works for you.

[jasonmichael]

OK Buzz:  my comparator looks different than that - I'd like to post a picture...
Knagl:  Tried it - removed and rotated it back and forth several times.  Then turned it all the way to the left (lowest sensitivity?) and the coins just fall through but now into the machine without giving any credits.  Increased the sensitivity just a bit and now they do just what they've been doing -- falling through but out to the tray -- until such time as they start registering properly.
Neonkiss:  That's very generous of you - thank you!  Looks like I may be hitting you up on that offer!

[jasonmichael]

Adjusting the comparator as recommended and more...

[jasonmichael]

Finally, I jumped up eagerly first thing this morning to try what you've all recommended.  I decided I'd take some videos to show you what happened as I did all of this.  The videos came out great - capturing everything I wanted to show...but, THANKFULLY FOR ALL OF US, I reviewed the videos before posting them to you-tube and posting the links on here to take you there.  Let's just say that the reflections in the machine's metal showed a bit more than any of us would've wanted to see...next time I take videos I'll be sure to get dressed first!  Thanks again to all of you for all of your support!!!

[rickhunter]

   

[CVslots]

Finally, I jumped up eagerly first thing this morning to try what you've all recommended.  I decided I'd take some videos to show you what happened as I did all of this.  The videos came out great - capturing everything I wanted to show...but, THANKFULLY FOR ALL OF US, I reviewed the videos before posting them to you-tube and posting the links on here to take you there.  Let's just say that the reflections in the machine's metal showed a bit more than any of us would've wanted to see...next time I take videos I'll be sure to get dressed first!  Thanks again to all of you for all of your support!!!

Im sure that you wouldn't have been the first to do that! 

[Neonkiss]

BTDT
 

[Neonkiss]

If that doesn't work send me a PM with your address.
I'll send you another dollar compairator, just pay the postage and make a donation to the site if it works for you.

Replacement coin comparators are on the way along with decals requested.
Check you email for tracking info via FedEx Ground.

[jasonmichael]

So awesome!  Thanks a million!!