SAS Host controller DLL. What do you want to see?

[stayouttadabunker]

nothing...I'm still getting the red x's with the same old messages saying it can't find the .DLL's...

[Foster]

What is that screen ^^^ that I see you posted it running the app about then

[Foster]

I can try but I may have to turn on an actual XP computer to do the remote control
I will try it in VirtualBox XP first though

[stayouttadabunker]

I thought I got a new button called "Uninitialized" but my screen size was actually blocking the bottom button .
I only saw it when I re-sized my LCD screen from 800x600 to 1024X still-too-small-to-see....

[stayouttadabunker]

okay I'll send you an invite...uh PM me an email address?
I haven't done the "remote assistance" in a long time...you have my number?

[jay]

Just thinking about the number of machines at the larger casinos. To distribute fiber from a hub in P2P form- That would be a boat load of fiber.
The one thing I can say for sure is that fiber devices are more expensive than copper.

Here is what I am trying to get my head around:  
Considering on Monday you had a bank of 8 machines and then someone moves another 10 machines over, back hauling more fiber through existing infrastructure seems like a lot of work.
Casinos don't like to have workers on the floor running wires and such. So unless they did a good job in planning for any eventual reconfiguration I can't see that they would do it this way.
I have seen workers running all sorts of wires at the machine level but never a ladder in the middle of a blackjack pit while someone strings another home run back to the central distribution.  

I could see them running fiber distribution to each bank and then star-ing out from there. Or doing a mini-ring back to a single home run. A casino wide ring would not be in their best interest as a single failure would put their whole system into disarray.

What we "know" is that the machines use a RS232 interface which is a point to point technology. What we want to know is what is the Fiber interface ? and or are their other interfaces ?

The other possibility that exists is that they use the player tracking interface over a packet based network to get to the slots.
I support many remote locations that have firewalls and other devices on them, sometimes the devices fail due to a crappy ADSL internet connection or other interruption. Using modems or another network I can get to the site but if the hardware is hung I really need to get to the console interface. One way to achive this is to connect a Rs232 console cable to my server. Once I gain access to the server I can use Hyperterm, puddy or whatever to get to the device via serial.

So if the player tracking is packet based ethernet. it is not a stretch that this device sends/receives commands via a in-slot serial connection. Packet based networks (ie ethernet) are cheap and easy to implement. This would certanly be one way to interconnect many dis-similar platforms and tie it all into a single Casino Management System (CMS).
 

[Foster]

I thought I caught a post on here that they used fiber between the machines and then maybe TP back to the servers or something like that. It was a while ago

I do not know how accurate the set of Las Vegas (when they show backroom stuff)
a couple times they showed the network room, it looked like any other network room/closet I have seen.

Here is a screen shot of the TestApp

[jay]

I went to G2E a couple of years ago.
They had some back office tours available for about $200 ish
Since I am not really involved with the gaming industry I didn't want to push the envelope and sign up (in case there background checks to ensure you were associated with a casino)
and then when I was there and I had the time the space was not available. Kind of sorry I missed out. I am considering going this year again.

I would highly recommend G2E to anyone

[Forrhouse]

Jay.  The machines are controlle in banks of 32 machines.  For every addition of 32 machines you need an XVU (Cross Validation Unit).  As I understand it, the XVU syncs multiple databases for the different banks of machines so that they can commnicate with each other and the EZ-pay server.  Then there are cashiere terminals and CVT units. Each CVT handles 32 machines, has fiber optics on it that connect to the comm board on the 1st machine in the bank. Another fiber optic cable cable links comm to comm and the process is repeated untill the 32nd machine (Notice the blue and grey fiber optics ports on the comm boards).   Anyway, I don't know if any type of termination on the last machine is neccessary as I have only used fiber optics in a pro-audio recording studio environment and otherwise no nothing else about it. There are routers in the systems with multiple SSL certificates. I know what SSL encryption is, but I do not know how it is implimented. I am assuming that the routers link the diifferent banks of 32 machines together.   So, you have one Ez-pay server, multiple data bases, multiple XVU units, multiple CVT untis which are the cashiers terminals, multiple SSL certificates to encrypt evrything.  Obviously I am missing some of the EZ pay puzzle here, like how the fiber optics and ethernet are implimented between the server room and between banks of machinesa and I am probably missing some other stuff too, but I think most can get an idea from this description of how the process works.
E~

[CaptainHappy]

We do not need any of this     

We are  all over this DLL and TestApp

IF I could give Andy 100+ Karma instantly I would but I did give him a  for now.

Casinos use Fiber Optic networks or at least I believe they do since the S2000 has 2 of them on the comm board.
Fiber is harder to tap into than regulaer Ethernet or WiFi.
So in theory it is more secure than ethernet. nothing is hack proof.

? ??


- we need re karma dog to show up.

WOOF WOOF!!! 00

Fortunately, I can give +100 Karma, and as a reward to Andy, I did just that! It is from everyone!!!!

Thanks to Andy for all of his hard work already and into the future!!! I have too much personal stuff going on to try to test, but I look forward to seeing what happens!!!

CaptainHappy

[AndyP]

Lol J, only 2 layers in the SAS model! Physical and application!

The Fibre is pretty straight forward and not very high tech. As far as I know its an IGT hangover. Its a cheap plastic fibre from Agilent (formerly HP) called versalink. You loop it from machine to machine. So it basically goes out of PC (or host controller) into machine 1, out of machine 1 into machine 2, out of machine 2 back into PC (or host controller). This is where the whole loop concept comes from. It runs at the same baud rate as rs232.

For SAS, the upper limit is about 32 machines on a loop.


We use this fibre in some states in Australia. All QCOM machines (queensland australia protocol) use fibre, and each machine has a fibre optic to rs232 converter, so all machines have an rs232 interface, with and rs232 to Fibre converter.

I have designed several FO converters, and I still have all the schematics, they are pretty simple.

[CaptainHappy]

I did not want this lost on the previous page as I really feel Andy deserves the Kudos!!!

CaptainHappy

We do not need any of this     

We are  all over this DLL and TestApp

IF I could give Andy 100+ Karma instantly I would but I did give him a  for now.

Casinos use Fiber Optic networks or at least I believe they do since the S2000 has 2 of them on the comm board.
Fiber is harder to tap into than regulaer Ethernet or WiFi.
So in theory it is more secure than ethernet. nothing is hack proof.

? ??


- we need re karma dog to show up.

WOOF WOOF!!! 00

Fortunately, I can give +100 Karma, and as a reward to Andy, I did just that! It is from everyone!!!!

Thanks to Andy for all of his hard work already and into the future!!! I have too much personal stuff going on to try to test, but I look forward to seeing what happens!!!

CaptainHappy

[AndyP]

Thanks CaptainHappy, only just realised what karma is!! Unfortunatly next week I am going to start work on a G2S library, so this project will go to the wayside. I will complete the montanna spec and upload it early next week, but the resident c# guru's will have to take over soon. I am actually pretty happy with what I have acheived in the last 2 weeks. I will continue to work on the dll, but paid work unfortunatly has to take priority.

BTW, here is the Queensland OLGR spec for the Fibre interface. Its got a good pic on page 15 that describes what I was trying to say

http://www.olgr.qld.gov.au/resources/gamDocs/mon_sys/EGMLANRequirementsV2_1.pdf

[stayouttadabunker]

Here's a link for anyone that wants a better understanding of C# programming language ??? >>>

http://www.csharphelp.com/2006/12/c-tutorial-for-beginners/

And from Wikileaks    uh... Wikipedia...lol >>>


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C_Sharp_%28programming_language%29

It would be good if we could a partial copy of a bit of your programming notes Andy,
so we can compare it these help tutorials for those that want to do a crash course on C# language?

It was interesting to me how you implemented and
utilized the SAS sheet into the Test App .DLL as a template of sorts.

ADD>> I'm still having problems trying to get to this screen shot that Foster was able to get to.
I'm wondering if it's some sort of a port issue my laptop is having?
The Test App still won't populate even after hitting the "continue" button... >>>

[stayouttadabunker]

Close, but you need the .net framework 2. I chose version 2 because most people will already have it installed. I thought the installer asked you to install the correct framework if not already installed, but I could be wrong.

The initialise button opens the comm port and starts polling the gaming machine. It wont do anything if you dont hit initalise.

The installer asks for framework 4...so the number# 2 .net framework version doesn't get used because of this?
What would happen to my laptop if I delete and remove all the Net Framework versions from my computer installed after .Net #2?
You'd think .Net Framework 4 would be "backwards" compatible with this .DLL App?

[jay]

We need to get the S+/PE+ interface working ....... 

[stayouttadabunker]

We need to get the S+/PE+ interface working .......  

I think I have some...These were in S+'s.
Will probably work on the PE+ as well...
Left side boards are: ASSY NO 7542200   1992
revised in 1993 and changed revision number to: 75422001
Probably good for SIS communications really...

Right boards are: ME2944V02199 Spintek's hopper board. (disregard?)

Searching for schematics as we speak... >>>


ADD>> These are hard-wire boards only.
            Fiber optic board next post below...

[stayouttadabunker]

This unit I picked up a while back might be for fiber optic FO PC-SAS communications.
Anybody know how to hook it up?
I have a whole bag of connectors and wiring that came with it including brand new fiber optic lines. >>>

[Forrhouse]

Great pics Bunker!  I have some of the cards in the left of your picture, but have never seen the ones in the right side of your pics.
The box in your other pic, I believe, is used to convert from and to different protocoalls for player tracking, such as IGT, Bally (Bally Miser?), etc.
Maybe it can be used for other aplications. Don't know.
E~

[stayouttadabunker]

It's actually in a schematics sheet but I can't find it at the moment.
the only schematics I've found are for the Fiber Optics  ....  :99-I want the hard line board version drawings
so I can hook up the left boards utilizing the Test App .DLL.
the boards up top on the right go right behind the hopper....
They have sensors which tell you if the hopper is pulled out I think...
They were made by Spintek.

I'm much more concerned with trying to use the board below than using Fiber Optics...>>>

[stayouttadabunker]

This board below is the one IGT came out with in 1993.
uses fiber optics only....bah
Anyways, they are small like the ones I posted earlier and use the same black cover.

The board for hard-wire is the ones you & I have and will
probably communicate/work with the Test App .DLL.
They were made in 1992 but I can't locate drawings at the moment...
the drawing of the FO board below at least shows me the TX and RX...
If I had a wiring drawing I could probably make up a workable harness...
If you closely scrutinized the ASSY NO 7542200 hard-wire board....
do you think you could come up with a pin out?
Click on the photo to make it really friggin' big so you can actually see it!!! lol >>>

[TZtech]

Well its got a Rs232 IC so it translates something to RS232 levels  - We just need to know what. If anybody has schematics for this please post

Edit
Ok so I went through a parts price list I had from my IGT days and it is exactly what we need.
75422000   BD,PC,INTF,DCS/RS232,ISLTD ASY
75422001   BD,PC,INTF,DCS/RS232,NON-ISO

Still need schematics to figure out the pinouts on the connectors.

[jdkmunch]

Ok it looks like Andy will come through with our dll today and then stop work on it.  What is missing that we would still need to implement.

I'm on The Explorer of the Seas about to set sale for a 9 night cruise an can look at some of this stuff. It's food to get away for awhile.

[reho33]

Or you can get a fiber transceiver that converts fiber into RS-232 signals on serial. We used them all the time at my job.

[Forrhouse]

I don't have the schematics to the earlier board, but if someone finds them. Please post.
I used to have a few of those cables, but try finding them in about 400 to 500 pounds of tangled up wiring.
Who knew that they would ever be needed as they were used for player tracking.  Ugh!
Interestingly enough I found some Bally ones that were in my S6000s. They have fiber.