Bally 1091-31 I really messed up! Please help

[vic147]

Hi everybody I was trying to install a candle top for my Bally Em to make it short y couldn't installed it because of the wires ( they didn't match) so I started hooking cables and I made a short circuit ! When I changed the fuse the machine turned on and works fine, then I close the door and when I insert a coin and play spins wheels turn, but as soon as I get a pay the hopper overruns the pay lights wobble and then it blows the same fuse I had changed, dooing tests with the door open and works perfect! Plays, pays the exact amount when a win occurs.
So I put a  screwdriver on the door switch, play the machine works perfect until I get a pay and the same thing happens the hoper overruns lights wobble ( only the small lights, the rest are ok, and blows the fuse. I have no idea how to fix this.

Please please help,

Il post some pictures in a short while

[OldReno]

I'd say first undo any wiring that you put in and get it back to original.
Which fuse is it blowing?  The 6V fuse has blue wire going to it, the 50V has orange, and the 120 is/are either white or black.
To run a 6v light you need to use the solid blue wire, and some offshoot of the yellow common wire.  You can find both of these on your transformer.  Run one straight up to your light, and run the other one through your on/off switch for that light, if you're just running a 'change' light. Putting an inline fuse would be a good idea, too.  If you want a light that lights up during pays, you'll have to run it through your hopper payout relay switches, which is a different story.
After you get it back to original read the post on checking for shorts http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=17559.0 and that may give you some ideas.  Make sure your machine is short-free before you start running wires, as you may already have half a short built in. The Bally was designed to have NO shorts to case, and all circuits are isolated from case.
Did the machine work ok originally?
Also, does it work fine with door open, or does it also blow fuse with door open?
Send pics!!!

[vic147]

Thankyou very much for the info, sorry for not posting pictures but here they are.

When i was hooking the candle top the speaker made a loud noise, the candle top lighted but blew the lights (all 3 of them)

Ive undone everithing i did and left it the way it was, yes the machine was working perfectly, it still does unless i close the door or tamper with the door switch
last time i tried it with the door closed it made a loud buzzing noise, the hopper overran with a 3 coin pay and the lights woobled and then it blew the fuse
(should i try it with the door open and see where the buzz comes from?)
i am afraid to even turn it on.

[vic147]

attaching 2 more pictures

I attached the cable from the candle top to the blue wire on picture and thats when it shorted out. (picture # 1)
and the black wire to the frame of the machne.

Could it be that the thing (dont know the name ) in picture 4 blew? and just replace it?

Thankyou very much (I promise i wont touch the machine ever)

[vic147]

I just noticed this, when i turn on the machine the Tilt light comes on, but as soon as i insert a coin it turns off
reels spin, music sounds, and if i hit a pay it pays the exact amount, the paid light comes on, and on the second
spin the paid light comes off.
And another ting, when playing with the door open the chime does not work, it only makes the Ding sound
with the door closed, or presing the door switch, is this normal? (that allways had happened since i bought the machine)
Since i dont have schematics for this machine im not shure where to start.

Tankyou

[OldReno]

Ok, you're blowing your 120V fuse, so I suggest you get a power strip with an on/off switch, and when you're dinking around in the machine, turn off the strip. You've got some modifications on there that are not standard Bally, and are add-ons. 
So, get yourself a good supply of fuses (don't over fuse the machine, use the same amps as what was in there).
If you don't have a VOM, or a continuity meter, then one other way of finding out shorts is to one by one start unplugging things, and see when the problem disappears.
First thing I'd do is unplug that sound system at the top of your top box, and get that out of circuit.  You can always plug it back in later.
Also, I'm not sure what that plywood thing does in pic #2, but a better shot of that would help.  Is that where your Encapsulated Relay (the blue guy in last photo) came from? I can't tell by the pic what that assembly is.
Get some electrical tape, and take apart the plug modifications shown in your first picture, to make sure all the wiring is good. Make sure all the wires look ok and connect well, and see if any colors mismatch.  Make sure no wires are touching other wires, and clean it up good.
Next look for something wrong in the door, if there are any wires or sockets that are touching to the case when the door is closed.
Get yourself a cheap VOM, if you don't already have a meter, at harbor freight or some other store, you can get them for under $10 usually.
That will help you track this down.
Also, you can work on the machine hot, BUT, use the one hand in the pocket rule: do NOT rest one arm on the case or touching metal while you're poking around in there, you may hurt yourself if you provide a circuit with your body. Always be careful.
As I've said, there should be NO wires grounding to case other than the 120V from the plug coming into the machine.  If you get an ohm-meter, it will let you track down shorts to case, with the power off.
Don't be afraid of the machine, just be CAREFUL.
I'm guessing you have several shorts, and they just happen to be showing up now.
Don't leave the machine on when you're gone until we get the problem fixed, and have your OFF switch from your power strip where you can get to it quickly if you smell smoke, or see something starting to spark.
It is always a good idea to get rid of shorts to case, even though some casinos used to put them in intentionally, there is no need for that for an at home machine.  They will only lead to problems down the line.
Also, whenever you make a change to your machine, or tear apart something you're not familiar with, take photos of it and write down on a piece of paper what you did, what you moved, etc.  That way you can get it back to original when you're done.
Keep at it.  We'll be here....

[vic147]

Thank you so much, tomorrow is my day off i will go downton and buy the fuses and the continuity meeter to start looking for the trouble.
there are a total of 6 Encapsulated relays on the machine 3 on top of the sound board, one on the hopper, and one on the front door.
I know this machine has been modified a lot of times, the person who sold it to me said he had an electric mechanic that fixed it from time
to time, sadly he passed away a couple of years.

[vic147]

one more image, i have no idea of what this does.

On this pic i can see a green wire hooked to the case of the machine, there are a lot of those all over the machine.

Anyway thankyou very much.

[OldReno]

The green wire (next to fuse) is your case ground, and it should be from the plug from power from the wall.  That should be the only place the machine is grounded.  No other wires should touch case, but because of the modifications made to the machine, we don't know what's going on.  They may have used case as a return for some of the new circuitry, but we'll find out as we go.
You may want to start unscrewing some of those other case wires you find, and see if it makes any difference.  Make sure to jot everything down that you do so you have notes on how to put it back together.
What is that plywood piece, what is on it?  Looks like one of those ER's.... Yep.  OK, Try and trace out some of those wires to see where they go.
Your middle fuse, it appears they have put in a resettable one.  Probably because they got tired of changing fuses out.
Anyway, this sounds like a good and hopefully fun project for you (and maybe...me and others who want to join in)
Remember, when you get your meter, and use the ohms scale, to NOT have power going to the machine.  don't want to hurt the meter. You should first just be checking for continuity on dead circuits to find your shorts.
Cool.

[vic147]

Thank you so much for the info! and now a small update!
I just bougt the multimeter and started to do more tests like you said checking for shorts, on all 3 wires i got the same reading!
50.8 ohms ( so im asumming there are no shorts on the machine?)
I also found 2 more cables hooked to the case (attaching pictures) but i still canot figure out what is going on with the machine!
All the wires that run fron the 3 Electric rellays go to the stepper unit and back, so i really don´t know what is going on!

So i think the next step is to unhook those ER´s?

Thanks in advance

Sorry for the delay, i could not get off from work, hopefully this weekend il get it working again!

[vic147]

Well after a couple of days my Bally is finnaly working! thank you very much!
Couldn´t do it with out your help!!, and all of the great info on this site!

I had to keep the Electronic rellays because they were directly hooked to the stepper unit, hopper
and coin mech. (i promise i wont tinker with it again!)

Ty all   

[OldReno]

 
Sure is pretty....
Nice work!!!