Need Help Troubleshooting an AC Coin IGT S+ (Barcrest style)

[angryninjas]

Hey guys, I finally got this Empire King machine fully restored with 2 exceptions... the first is the bill acceptor... just needs a new one.  Easy.  The second is a really odd one and has me stumped...

The top bonus box on these are similar to a Barcrest, where once the bonus is activated, it randomly selects one of the amounts on the bonus top box, anywhere from 15 coins up to 1000 coins.  There are 12 different amounts it can land on.  EVERY amount works fine, except for the 50 coin one.  When you land on it, the voice on the machine still says "congratulations, you're a winner", but it doesn't pay out anything.  The hopper doesn't even attempt to spin. No error codes... nothing.   I would think if it was the wiring, a motherboard, or something like that, that none of them would pay out at all.  When I restored the machine, the light bulb was burnt out behind the 50 credit one, so I thought maybe it had to make the electrical contact to make it pay by having the bulb light up, but I replaced the bulb and that didn't make a difference.  I'm stumped... any ideas?  I've never had a Barcrest or anything with a bonus topper box like this AC Coin, so I don't even know where to begin tracing the problem.

here's a pic.  The troublesome non-paying 50 credit amount is located in the top left corner.

[knagl]

Cover the "50 Credits" with "Bankrupt".         

Sorry, I wish I knew anything about the machine.  Hopefully someone who does will come to the rescue, but I know there aren't a lot of those out there, especially still in working condition.

[angryninjas]

Cover the "50 Credits" with "Bankrupt".         

Sorry, I wish I knew anything about the machine.  Hopefully someone who does will come to the rescue, but I know there aren't a lot of those out there, especially still in working condition.

Lol, that's funny, because that's exactly what I've done until I can figure it out.  I printed a sticker of a bi plane firing on King Kong and it says "Shot Down - 0 Credits".   The only problem is the voice on the machine still says "Congratulations, your're a winner!", so it doesn't quite make sense, plus it's noticeable that the sticker is on the outside, and all the other symbols are silk screened behind the glass.  The "Shot Down" ties in well, because when it selects the 0 credit payout up there, king kong has climbed to the very top of the machine (or empire state building if you will)... so it would make sense that a plane could shoot him down.  Here's a pic of what I've done... still need to figure out the proper fix  though.  I would assume it works the same way as the Barcrest models, which there are more of out there, so hopefully someone will know. 

[cowboygames]

The winner he's referring to is the pilot that shot Kong down, lol. Unfortunately, unless you can find a schematic for that top box backplane you may be SOL. Especially with AC coin being out of business now

[angryninjas]

The winner he's referring to is the pilot that shot Kong down, lol. Unfortunately, unless you can find a schematic for that top box backplane you may be SOL. Especially with AC coin being out of business now

Lol, true.  Yeah, I don't know if the problem lies in the AC Coin hardware or the IGT hardware.  My linear thinking brain says that they should all work, or all not work, like it should be software related.  In my mind, software on the microchip should just say:

- Machine says activate random bonus on topper box
- Select a random number between 1 and 12 (representing the spots)
- Tell hopper to pay variable amount of credits depending on result

If I was programming this in computer language:

Declare BonusAward(Int)
BonusAward=Rnd(int, *1-12)
Function ActivateBonus
If BonusAward > 0 then
  HopperPay BonusAward(int)
Else GoTo NormalGame
End If

(sorry if incorrect syntax... falling back on my memory from 10 years ago programming in Visual Basic, lol)

Still, you'd think the code would look something like that, and the hardware and wiring would only have two states... working or not working.  The amount of the pay should be software based, not hardware based.  Maybe my sticker will have to be good enough 

[angryninjas]

close up of sticker

[CommTech]

Very cool game. I remember playing that one many years ago. 
When you replaced the bulb behind the 50 credit window, does the position light correctly now?
I also have no knowledge of how the top box would be wired. 
I would have to speculate that it is more likely a hardware issue than a software issue.  Perhaps an open circuit trace or bad gate. 
I would also conclude that the problem will be in the top box, not in the main machine.
A schematic of the top box would be a big help.   

[angryninjas]

Yeah, I'd love to get my hands on a schematic, but with this machine I think it would be like looking for a needle in a stack of needles.  The only thing I have going for me on that is that there were 3 games, and all 3 of them would have the same schematic.  Empire King, Jack and the Beanstalk, and Merlin.  If anyone ever finds a schematic for any of the 3, PLEASE send it my way  

Yeah, the light lights up correctly now that I replaced the bulb in that position, so I know that position is getting power.   I originally thought that all the top box stuff was in the top box, but believe it or not, no.  There is just as much, if not more, controllers and circuits added to the bottom IGT cabinet than there is in the top box.  I think the bottom cabinet has more AC Coin electronic parts than IGT parts.  The top box houses 1 motherboard, with 2 smaller board on top of it, the motor for the monkey, and 2 big florescent ballast.  The wiring feeds down to the bottom cabinet, where there are 3 large AC coin motherboards mounted behind the reels, with several daughter boards on top of those.  I've identified obviously the main controller boards, as well as the additional built in sound boards (2 in total, mounted on top of the main ac coin board in the top cabinet).  The daughter boards on top of the main ac coin boards behind the reels also have a total of 4 micro dip switches, which I cannot see a difference in game play when switching them.  They are individual switches mounted in different locations, not a bank of 4 together.  Would love to find out what they do.