Bally 809 relay not releasing?

[1inxs]

You guys in the forum have been super in helping me with getting my Bally 809 functioning properly. I am having another issue with the Slot related to a relay not releasing or a bad contact? This problem is occurring more often as I use the slot. When I insert the first nickel, the slot will register it as the second. The light designating it as the second nickel will stay lit for up to 5 seconds along with a slight buzzing sound and then change back to a single coin designation. It will then fail to register any other nickel inserted into the slot. Now when I pull the slot handle, it automatically resets the accepted coin relay. I can pull the slot handle for possibly up to 30 minutes or more without ever inserting another nickel. Then at some point it starts working properly, requiring me to insert nickels to play.

[Op-Bell]

It sounds like the coin register step-up unit in the top box is not resetting properly. It has two coils, one to step up and one to reset, along with a plastic ratchet with a return spring wrapped round the shaft and a star of wiper contacts. The first coin should reset it all the way to 1. The reset coil will buzz until the wiper gets all the way back, where a pin on the ratchet wheel hits a bank of contacts that break the reset circuit and do other mysterious things to allow more coins. It sounds like the rotor is sticky or the return spring is weak - check the spring, and give the shaft a good clean until it resets smartly and whacks those contacts over.

[1inxs]

You say the step-up unit in the top box. Is it the Hopper Payout unit? I can see a screw that if removed will allow a mechanism to drop down for service. There are the following parts in the exploded view.
Step- Up Arm Switches
Torsion Spring
5 - Step Delay Relay Cam & Micro- Sw
Step- Up Backlash Stop
Ratchet Gear
Step- Up Coil
Reset Coil
Pawl Springs
Reset Pawl Switches.

Am I looking at the correct section?  This is in the Hopper in the bottom of the slot machine.

[Op-Bell]

The coin step-up unit is in the top, on that wood frame that pulls out. It looks very similar to the hopper counter and works much the same way, but its job is just to count 1 to 5 coins as they go in the slot.
 

[1inxs]

Sorry, these slots contain many components and this is the only slot machine I've ever owned or serviced. Is it in this picture? Do I need to somehow get into the upper compartment behind the red glass, to see the Step- Up Unit?

[Op-Bell]

Yes, it's behind the top glass. With the main door open you should be able to lift the top glass by the metal strip that runs along the door edge, and pull it forward. The glass will then fall out downwards. Behind it is a white wooden panel carrying the lights, and this is the front of a large assembly of relays and counters that plugs in at the back. Usually there are two finger rings to pull it out. It takes a sharp tug to start it and then it slides out forward.

The step up unit you're looking for is probably on the left. There are some other odd things up there, including four things that look like pinball score counters - which is in fact what they are, although the middle two are 12 step, not 10. These are to divide the coin-out pulses by 2, 3, 4 and 5 respectively to multiply the payouts. The relays serve to switch one or other of these dividers in circuit, and to take care of the jackpot lockup.

[Neonkiss]

Aha, Another nice IGT referb of a Bally machine.
It look very nice.

[1inxs]

 I got the top glass removed and I tugged the two rings to remove the Step- Up unit. You were right on the money.  The ratchet returns partially and the contacts are caught between two contacts. I am able to gentle move it into position and it cures the issue. How do I know if the spring applies the proper tension? If the spring is weak, do I replace the spring or add a secondary spring to assist the worn spring? What is the proper method to clean the shaft?

Aha, Another nice IGT referb of a Bally machine.
It look very nice.

Could you tell by the IGT plate mounted above the Bally plate? I wondered about the IGT tag.

[Op-Bell]

The spring is applying the proper tension when it can reset the ratchet and change those contacts over from the 2-coin position (1 step forward). If it's not broken, you don't need to replace it or add another one. It has one end hooked in a hole in the ratchet wheel, and you can add tension by moving this to another hole further round. To clean the shaft you'll have to take off the contact spider and push the shaft out, noting carefully where everything goes so you can put it back together. Wipe it off with kerosene or WD40, not forgetting to clean out the bush with a Q-tip, and reassemble with a thin smear of grease or light oil. If you don't care to disassemble it there may be an oil hole in the bush that you can lubricate to save you the trouble, but the shaft is probably sticky and stiff with dried oil and grease and will never be trouble-free without cleaning. You can try liberal application of kerosene or WD40 to clean it up, after taking off the contacts so you can gain access to the bush and slide the shaft in and out a bit to work the solvent in.

[1inxs]

I'll take a close look at it towards the end of the week. I think you're correct about the dried oil and grease. I'll disassemble, clean and lubricate it before reassembly. I'll post back with the outcome. Thanks a lot for all the help.

[1inxs]

I finally had a chance to look closer at the step- up unit. Without an exploded assembly diagram, I didn't have the courage to attempt disassembly. While holding onto the plastic ratchet, I was able to ever so slightly shift it from side to side. It didn't feel any noticeable friction or opposition. So it didn't appear to be extremely sticky or gummy? I'm sure in the long run, it would be useful to disassemble and clean, but my service instruction manual excludes the exploded view of the step- up unit. I was able to move the tension spring one notch ahead on the ratchet sprocket, but I'm positive it couldn't be moved another notch, so it's at maximum tension. I reinstalled the step- up unit, powered up the slot and ran $80.00 worth of nickels through it and was unable to get the slot to fail. Thanks again Op-Bell for the help. If you or anyone else is able to post an exploded view of the Step- Up unit, it would be appreciated. With the exploded view I would be able to disassemble, lube and reassemble.