New Life Games Tech Forums

I realize this topic is all over the forum but I can't seem to get the information I need after going through seemingly countless threads on the same or similar subject! Sorry if this may be a repeat question.
I have an IGT S plus slant top (I have read the DBV is the same as an upright) with a JCM DBV-45. The previous owner said it was working when he removed it (didn't want it in machine when he owned it). I reinstalled everything, and connected all the wires. Everything seemed quite obvious and I also was able to see pictures of a similar looking setup on a slant top, previously posted - recently.
I am getting no life signs whatsoever. My first question is - If the DBV package was removed, does the machine by default, disable it? Or do I need to re-enable it? I pressed the self test button until I saw the 9, and there was a 0 in the credit window. When that 0 is present, is the power to the DVB power supply cut off? Or is it just being sent a signal to the unit to not power up? Either way, I'd like to get this once working validator up and working.

Let's start here. When you power up the machine, the BV should cycle. This is independent of anything as long as the BV unit is geting power. If it's not cycling, it will never work and you need to find out what is wrong.



No. Once enabled, it will stay enabled unless the game was changed (sometimes) or something like a clear chip was used.



What you see in self test has nothing to do whether or not the BV has power. You can enable a BV even if it's not present.

However, are you sure you were looking at the right setting? Typically you need to use the jackpot key to cycle through the page <0> settings to get to the BV setting. What you are looking for is a 0 on the coins played and a 9_0 or 9_1 in the coins paid window.  If you are pressing the self test button until you have a 9 in the coins played, then you are looking at the wrong thing.

But we need to first go back to the getting the BV to cycle when powered up. You should have a small black power supply like this one (it may or may not have slots in it since you have a 145 head). Make sure it it plugged in to the main power supply.

Pictures of your setup will help.

does the machine work now? reason I ask---if its working then we can assume all the fuses and power is good. lets not worry about the bill acceptor being enabled. as soon as power is applied the unit should cycle. even if the cash can is removed, it should cycle.
there are 4 connections you should have made. there are four assemblies you should have, the head and transport assembly, the asseblly that the head and transport rest on and also support the cash can, and of course the  cash can itself  and the power supply assembly.
the power supply has two connections, one goes to the 145 head front connector, the other attaches to the harness in the machine, this harness is a 9 pin connector(I think this is from memory) two of the larger wires on this connector go to the 115 vac to provide power to the power supply, the other four wires go to J-6 on the motherboard , these are communication and other signal lines. one connection is to the back connector on the 145 head this is for the bezel lamp control, the other connection is the four pin connector that goes into the head and transport unit, this is the cash can optics, the last connection is from the right side of the 145 head to the transport unit itself.
if all these are present and no activity then you have to establish that you are getting 115 ac to the power supply, if so, are you getting 12vdc out of the power supply, if so (wiggle that 12 connector on the 145 head sometimes intermittent)  if all that is good  then I would suspect the head/ transport unit.
did you check and see if there was a bill stuck in the transport unit?

Jim

Poppo: The BV does not cycle when power is turned on. I was testing wrong, using the reset key. I can try it the other way and see what happens. Jim: The machine does work and I think everything's connected. The previous owner told me he simply removed the working BV set and put it in a box for storage. I'll post pictures now and I'll pull the BV back out and check for anything stuck... I did make sure all the connectors were seated properly and making good contact.

BV and main power supply

On the right side of the BV head, there should be a cable connecting the head to the transport. If that cable is missing or not seated, it won't do anything.

Also there should be a small red LED on the BV head board between those two connectors on the left side of the BV head. Is it lit up? Unless that cable below is missing, you probably need a meter to see if your BV power supply is working.

Can I pull that thing out w/o unscrewing the case out? I do see the cable, can't see a red light

I'm not sure how a slant top is mounted. But typically the head and transport come out pretty easy with just a lever on the left side and a couple of thumbscrews in the front .

i see it...i'll be back

I removed the thumbscrews, and pulled the lever and it's out. The cable was connected and the other cable is present.

It's DBV 145-SS Version 3. 11-11
DRM 2-00 NEW VERSION

Just noticed this...two wires appear to have pulled off their connections? Are these important?!! Looks like weak solder joint or maybe they were yanked out before.

Well, if everthing is connected properly, then you probably need to start checking voltages unless you have access to spare parts. The BV power supply would be suspect. You can always open it up and look and see if it looks toasted. I think there is a fuse inside of it.

I just modified my last post and added a picture...let me know.

Yep, I would say they are probably important. Hard to tell from your picture what they are from.

Here's a cropped, zoomed version of the same. It's the top two wires from the backside of the face. One wire says 5. I'm not with the machine right now but I'll be back later and can look closer.

We really need a wider shot of what that is.  Is that just the bezel (where it says "Insert Bills $1 to $100" (or similiar) on the other side of what you're showing us)?  If so, that's likely not the reason your validator isn't getting power.  The area to focus on right now is the connection between the power supply and the validator, and also if you can you'll want to test the voltage coming out of the power supply to make sure it is providing power.

Yes that's the backside of the bezel  - I'm headed back home and I can shoot a wider picture if you still need it.

Here's the entire unit -  with broken wires at far right side.

I wonder if they shorted out on something and possibly fried the BV head or something.

I don't see any sign of frying...they look like they were weak solder joints. I've removed the bezel and I see where each wire goes. The other side of the wires lead to a two pin connector that's on a small circuit board (with three resistors and a diode) Should I just solder them back in while I have it apart? I still think you may be right and there's an issue with the power supply.

If you are sure which wire goes to which point, I would go ahead and fix them.

I would check the large cap in the power supply
for a bad solder joint. I had one doing strange things
and that was the problem.

Here is Roberts findings.

http://www.myslotnotes.com/Work%20PDF/result0379.pdf (http://www.myslotnotes.com/Work%20PDF/result0379.pdf)

Paul

Note that that document also shows the fuse that is in there. Check to see if it has blown.

Okay I just soldered in the two wires, powered up and got lights...green lights on the "INSERT BILL" area. These wires simply supply to the lights and are independent of the power supply since, when I pulled it out, the lights stayed on! I've taken out the little power supply and will open it up and check things.

Visually, the power supply looks okay. That cap is cleanly soldered in. The fuse is good. I think the power supply isn't getting power or it's not putting out power. Now I just need to know where to look for voltages. I assume it's DV in and out?

I also tried to check settings with the reset key switch, just to rule as much out as possible. I get to a 0 in the coins played window but just get 8888 in both winner paid and credits windows. I think there's no power to the DBV.

If you look at the bottom of the link
you will see the out put voltage and
the pin orientation.

Do you know the voltage from the output connector; the one that goes directly to the BV? Or, the input voltage to the power supply from the 9 pin connector? It might be easier to check that way.

I was able to take it apart, and power it up...no output voltage. I don't think the power supply is getting voltage but I'd still like to check.
Thank you for all the help so far!!!

Here ya go. Click on it to enlarge. The important pins are the 117VAC input, and the 12VDC output on pins 1 &2

Not sure if I'm reading that right (and thank you, though!) - I'm not a real tech...I just can figure things out. I did check the input connector to the BV power supply and get nothing. I'm assuming it's a DC input, but I checked for AC also. I think I could have fried my multimeter if is was an AC input and was hot! I get nothing. I traced the harness down to the big power supply but not sure where to go from here. Sorry if I'm sounding uh...uneducated!

Just re-read your last post...good thing it wasn't hot! No AC input on the small power supply!

Ok, check the output from the main power supply where the black and white wires are. Make sure that plug is seated. You should also be able to move it over to the next plug. Check your main power supply fuses too.

Make sure your meter is set right. You can check it by measuring a wall outlet for AC.

BTW, you won't hurt the meter by having it set for DC instead of AC. You just won't get a reading.

Before I got your reply, I realized that the 9 pin connector was reversible. It appeared I had it in backwards! I reversed it and the BV cycled. I had to run an errand and, when I came back, I smelled something BURNING. Now I have a 3300 error code and a bad smell. This is getting very frustrating. It clearly looked like the plug was reversed and, again, I heard the BV cycle! The smell appears to be coming from the main power supply but it's hard to tell. I am very bad at tracing smell locations.
The BV is now cycling but I'm getting an error code and the smell does indeed appear to be coming from the main power supply. I think I took something out when I messed with the plug. I wasn't using my brain and seeing which wires were lining up. I am 100% sure the power to the BV is fine since it's cycling each time I turn the main power on.
I'm getting a 3100 error code and the machine does not go through the usual start up cycle. I've killed my once perfectly working slot machine.
Shit!
This DBV would probably worked just FINE if I hadn't plugged the damn thing in wrong...twice! I've never seen a plug that was not generally fool proof. This one in particular can be plugged in wrong in two different positions.

Well I've killed the CPU. I did find the source...see the picture. I cannot believe I actually did this. One of the IC's is quite fried and the trace looks cooked beyond repair I believe - not sure.  I have no idea where to go from here now. Well, at least the bill validator cycles! Should I try and replace this fried chip or just get a new CPU board off Ebay?

Well, IMO you should just get a new MPU. While that board may be fixable, there is a good chance there is more wrong with it than that resistor pack (besides the burnt traces).

That is RP4 that cooked and is shown below. Notice how it has the signals for coin in/out and the BV. That is most likely why you are getting the 3300. When you plugged that cable in backward, it probably fed the 117VAC into the wrong lines and thus the  :98-

I'm a little confused on when the BV started to cycle. Was it after the plug was put back the right way? If so, most likely it just was not seated good to begin with.

Note: It looks like the trace to pin 10 of RP4 is the most burt. And that is the BV in signal.

On a side note, keep in mind that RP4 is just a resistor network and not an IC. Any incorrect voltage fed into it, would pass through it into the next components. That is why I don't think replacing just RP4 will fix the problem.  Also, I hate to say it, but it's possible that plugging that connector in wrong also did some damage to the BV head. It may cycle now, but there is a chance it won't work after you get the MPU issue resolved.

Don't get too discouraged. Many of us at some point have killed our working machines. It's part of the learning process. The good news is that a replacement MPU board shouldn't run more than about $30. eBay is an option, but try posting a WTB post in the classifieds section on this site first and you'll get a better chance of getting a good board sent to you.

Yep. Sometimes several times.  :47- It's one of the reasons I look for good deals on craigslist. I've found it cheaper to buy a parts complete machine and strip it down for spare parts than to have to keep buying something everytime I  :50- something.

Yeah...it hurt all right. I had gone across the street to help my neighbor UNLOAD A SLOT that I found for them. When I came back, that AWFUL smell was in my garage. I guess the saying is true "No good deed goes unpunished."
I still can't believe someone (IGT or the PS manufacture?) would design a plug that could be put in multiple directions AND would carry AC, capable of death to mpu's.
Thanks, though, everyone for the comments...it helps although I'm still ready to whack my head against the garage wall.







Moderator: Split discussion of the problem from the WTB and merged it with the original post. SF :31-

Can you post a closeup of the connector in the other thread? I don't recall ever seeing any of the plugs that didn't have a 'keyway' of some sort to prevent just that.

I got one for $35 bucks shipped, heck I will toss in a 16 MHZ with the 10 MHZ

This connector did have a keyway. I just was using the wrong part of my brain to line it up. I lined up the two tabs at first then, somehow I reconnected it wrong again. I have no idea why I didn't look at the WIRES, which were color coded! Perhaps I should not drink while working on slots...but it wasn't that much!

...and finally, THIS would have avoided a burned out MPU board! I hope, maybe someone else new will learn from this and avoid some frustration.

Besides for the locking tabs, if you look closely, the plastic housing around the center pins along the three of the four edges are shaped different. In theory, you should not be able to plug them together wrong. But given enough  :154-, anyone can make a square peg fit in a round hole.

 :96-

And I DID notice that before... and plugged it in anyway. I think the connector got "soft" over time as well.
I've ordered a replacement board that I should receive next week. I hope I can just replace the game and % chips and be good to go? Maybe?

Since you were getting an error code after the incident, it looks like the machine was at least trying to boot. So you should be good to go. You will get a 61 error when you plug in the new board, but that is normal. If it were me, I would pull the CMOS on the replacement board first, to make it lose it's memory (since it will have the wrong data anyway). That way on boot-up, you will get a 'clean' copy of the EEPROM to it (when you clear the 61).

Oh and don't plug your chips in backwards.   :96-

Where is that one? Well I have a manual...I can look there and see although I'm not sure if there's a schematic or block diagram there.
Now, how do I get the SMELL out of my machine and garage???  :103-

Right next to the game and reel chip. It's marked CMOS on the board. It's the chip that is battery backed up and retains data between writes to the EEPROM. On boot-up the machine compares the EEPROM data to the CMOS and if they don't match, you get a 61. Clearing the 61 re-copies the data from the EEPROM to it. While not necessary to pull it, the data won't match anyway and you will get a 61. Pulling it for a few seconds basically erases it and there is less chance of getting stuck in a 61 loop (IMO).

shortrackskater  (Mark)   I think I would take a close look at the plugs you said you plugged together backwards.  I don't think it's possible to get them wrong. The reason I'm saying this is maybe you have a different problem and maybe you will smoke the replacemeat board. I hope I'm wrong but make sure !!

Lacquer thinner will give a car that new car smell. Try wiping the inside of your machine with some, can't hurt.

Buzz,

He posted pictures above of how he connected them wrong. And smoke rose after it. Having that plug off by 90 degrees would put 115VAC on some signal lines. As I noted, the plugs are 'keyed', but the picture shows it can be done.

What does concern me is those signal lines also go to/from the BV head and it's possible that got cooked too.

It still aggravates me that I simply lined up the two prominent tabs and just firmly pressed and the plugs meshed together. The first time (when I was troubleshooting) did not cause any damage...but the 90 degrees next switch was the "fryer." When I did get it correct, the BV did cycle and it kept doing it after powering the slot off and on multiple times after cooking. I just wanted to make sure I had really broken it! Even after that, the lights all came up, the reels aligned themselves, and the BV cycled as if it was waiting for money.

There is a good chance that this plug just was not seated good to start with, which was causing the initial problem of no power to the BV. Or maybe it was turned the wrong way, but in another direction and you just got lucky that it didn't cook.

I think I had that plug in "wrong and wronger" all along.    :279-
The new board is HERE already! I've replaced the game and reel proms. Lifted the CMOS from the new board for 30 seconds, then replaced it ...the CORRECT direction. I hope it's plug n play from here on. Only question is: what's U18? I am replacing from the old board to the new board as well, but I don't know what it does. It's located to the far left of the board, centered - with the volume pot at the bottom for reference.
Here's a picture of another source of SMELL. I just cut that part out and put some insulation material at the bottom and electrical taped the top.  :279-

Everything is in...powered on - the BV cycled, the reels moved slightly but no initial cycle and no error codes. When I shut this off (after cooking) it did have an error code but now there's nothing. I checked the dip switches and sure the IC's were seated and in the proper direction!

U18 is used for SAS and EFT communications. Unless you are playing around with trying to get SAS working, you don't need it.

is it possible that the mother board cooked too?

It looks undamaged to me and again, there was an error code when I last shut this off...

Make sure there are no pins bent on the MPU plugs. Also make sure the transformer on the tray is plugged in correctly (not offest). Also make sure the MPU is seated good. Some you have to really push down hard to get them to seat all of the way.

Are you getting any display at all?

Game and reel chips in the right sockets?

No bent pins, seated properly, ic's in correct sockets. Nothing...no display but BV cycles.

I know you probably already did this, but check all of the fuses again and the fuse holder caps.

Also, you might try leaving that pesky 9 pin BV cable unplugged in the off chance the BV is cooked and somehow messing with the MPU. Process of elimination.

Just did! I didn't really examine the caps...i'll do that now

I don't see anything wrong with the caps either...???

I would remove all of the chips you transfered, and check all of the legs again and then re-seat them. Might even use the CMOS from your old board (just in case the other one is bad or something). One bent pin os all it will take to make it not boot.

If your board has jumpers by the game and reel chips, make sure both are set the same way.

It's possible your new board is bad. I don't think there is anything else really wrong with the machine since you did get an error code even with the cooked MPU. So it was booting up to a point.  You can always try putting the old one back in just to see if it still gives you an error.

Okay...I'll try...also one thing - the transformer on the MPU case does smell although there's no physical evidence of it being burned...but could I have fried that? I hope that, most likely it's just residual smell from the resistor pack.

See my edit above about how it was booting to a point before. So your MPU transformer is probably good.

Jumpers were all okay and yes, I did unplug that 9 pin already...just in case. Do you know what U 54 does? Should I put the one in from the old board? This was a tested and working board, according to the seller...he's on this site so I'm sure he's highly reliable!

I'm going to try sticking the old board back in and see if I get the error code.

U54 is the CPU.

I would try putting your old board back in first to see if you can get at least an error or some display to come up. That will help to determine if you have other problems, or if the new MPU has issues.  

Old board in. I get error code b1 and the top candle lights start to flash - it's the CHANGE candle and button that light up and flash.

b1 or 61? 61 is normal any time you fiddle with the CMOS. In any case you are getting something. I hate to say it, but I think you got a bad replacement MPU.

But you can try swapping ALL of the socketed chips again and see what happens.

I think that is a 6...if the top segment was lite, I would have called it a G !

There are no letter codes, that is why I asked. If you still have the old board in, you should be able to press the self test and have it change to a 61_1 If it does that, I would not go any farther since you know you will get other errors. But it shows the machine is booting. If the replcement MPU is not at least giving you a 61, I think its bad.

...and I promise I'm not drinking wine! Okay...so I will put back in the new board, with chips and I'll be back...

I can see how a S+ n00b would call it "b1":

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_bVg1g8504p4/R5zcu7_WrlI/AAAAAAAAAHI/cQ56HmKlhbU/s320/st01.PNG)
(Image credit: Stolistic)

(No offense intended at all with the term "n00b" -- I was one not that long ago, too!)

No offense whatsoever! I'm VERY happy to be here...new or not! I've never seen a group of people as helpful - anywhere.
As a side note anyone know what happened to Emelie? That was a very fun and informative thread going on.

One chip I didn't swap out was U54. Should I? Maybe it's the culprit?

Can't hurt at this point. You know your old one is good.

Nothing...no code. Last chip I just realized I didn't swap out is U49. What does that one do? I'll just try it...

Sound chip. Probably not going to help.

I'm glad you people know what you're doing. I'd be totally lost.
Okay, nothing happened...no code.
"It's dead Jim"
Should I contact the seller at this point?

I would. I think we have pretty much determined that there is something wrong with it.

I would just check those two grey connectors on the bottom of the MPU one more time to make sure there are no bent pins. I know you already did, but I had one that would not boot and it turned out there was one pin bent causing the MPU not to seat all of the way.

I checked and they all look good.
Well a huge thank you again...I hope I can get another one soon. I guess this is a good excuse to go back to working on my Bally 809. I'm REALLY a novice with EM's but at least I can see stuff working, or not.
Thank you again everyone.

He fried the SP872 chip when he smoked the board :98- :98-. Board working now and on its way back to him.

It's odd that it would boot in his original board but not in the replacement.

I tried it in two different boards and it was dead. Put another 872 in and it fired right up.

Just saying it's pretty strange that it was booting in his original board. Anything is possible I suppose.

For everyone who was helping, especially poppo - the replacement MPU board (thanks coorslight115 for finding the bad chip) is working fine now and I'm back to a somewhat working machine aside from the original BV problem and a hopper optics problem (caused by my initial frying of the MPU board) posted in another thread. I'm getting an entire replacement hopper (it was very reasonably priced) which will solve my coin optic problem. I'll post again here when the machine is completely alive, which I hope will be very soon.

My MONEY STORM slant top is completely back to life! The hopper optic works although I learned there's different angled coin elevators for slant tops. The one on my replacement sent quarters INSIDE the machine, which could have been disastrous. Luckily I noticed before a large payout could have occurred. I replaced the elevator with my original one and attached the replacement optic head (after cleaning out a dime sized glob of stringy fuzz...from many pockets over the years) out of the housing.
My final problem was the BV, which started this entire mess when I plugged it in the wrong way, twice. After some cleaning, the BV now works although I'm now thinking of updating it since it only takes ones and "old" denominations of currency.

Congratulations to you -- that's a very nice looking machine!  I've always liked the look of the Money Storm kit, especially the reel strips.  Well done!   :244-

Great looking game Shorttrackskater!  :3- :244-
Those sit-down machines are fabulous to own.
Definitely a very comfortable machine to play on!
I'd love to get one of those someday but my poor back will NOT take it!  :96-

Thanks again everyone.
@Bunker...my back is STILL sore from trying to load this monstrosity in the back of an SUV and that was a month ago at least.
I actually thought I could "pivot" it in the back of the SUV once I rolled it up against the rear bumper. I couldn't even lift one end to get it on the dolly, much less roll it to the car. Luckily someone lived next door the the man I bought it from and he was able to help me. I don't remember if I mentioned this but the previous owner pulled the pin to remove the lower panel, which is unhinged (just sits in a long channel). It fell forward and broke his toe! That panel alone is heavy. 

The last one I went to pick up, I had my tools in hand. Out came the hopper, coin tray, MPU, glass, cash box, BV with transport. Every little bit helps. Of course having a trailer comes in handy too.  :89-