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Yesterday I bought a double diamond machine from a lady.  I had her plug it in and everything worked fine.  When i got it home and plugged it in, it paid the last winner (about 45 coins) then the problems started.  The top fuse blows every time i turn it on, the led display and insert coin light do not come on, and now the wheels spin constantly when its on.  I have thoroughly searched for coins, screws, washers, etc that may have fallen during transport.  The fuse does blow with the big board removed (dont know what its called).  I also inspected that board and cant see any burn marks on it or the power connector.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks

I'm going to assume this is a S+  Picture's would really help.  If it is a S+ lift out the MPU ( what you called the big board ) the mother board is the one it plugs into, remove I think 3 screws, lift it up and check for coins or tokens under it.

I have to shrink these pics before i send them but ill get right on that.  i removed the 3 screws but that only allows me to remove the clear plastic cover.  through trial and error i have determined that the fuse blows when i plug the bottom plug into the power supply (if that helps)

let me know if other pics would be helpful.

Ok.  I got the mother board out by removing 2 nuts on the back and 2 screws on the floor.  there are no coins anywhere that i can find.

The model number is b5133ciw

check on the back side of the handle solenoid, I have seen coins stuck there, between the back of the cabinet and the connectors of the solenoid.

Jim

I have spotted 2 big tokens in the very back of the power supply.  i can not get to them.  is there a trick to taking off the power supply box, it seems glued down

I fished them out, put it all back together and same thing.  no led lights, wheels spinning, and fuse blown.  help?

I doubt that those are causing your problem.  but if you want to remove the power supply there is a screw on the left side and a 5/16" nut/ washer on the top front about two inches toward the back. I can see the cover is already off.  undo all the power plugs in the rear.

from what you described with the 115vac power cord plugged in no fuses blow.  only when you plug in the bottom plug the fuse will blow.  meaning all the voltages that the power supply makes are good until you output them to the motherboard.

Did you check the area that I suggested?

I have really looked it over good including the soleoiod on the back wall for the handle.  the only place i cant totally see is in the power supply so i was gonna completely search it if i can get it off

...and your summary is correct

from what you described, you removed the entire card cage,  we wanted you to remove the mother board itself.  three screws  and four clip standoffs. sometimes you have to persuade the motherboard off the standoffs. (using a long thin shaft screwdriver) 

we could try something else to isolate to the problem!  remove all plugs from the motherboard, and then try to connect the harness from the bottom power supply plug to the motherboard.

this would remove all the 24vac outputs to the machine and test if anything underneath the board is shorting out, if the fuse still blows then something on or underneath the motherboard is the problem. if the fuse doesn't blow then connect one plug at a time until the fuse does blow, then we will know what area to concentrate in.

Jim

i got it off and don't see anything unusual.  no coins.

better pics

Do I understand correctly that I need to put the motherboard back in, connect only the power, then one by one connect everything else, checking the fuse after each connection?  i ran out of fuses so thats my first move in the morning.  Thanks for the help!!

yes, that will check out the mother board first with only power applied, then each plug, when the fuse blows then we will know which plug did it ,look for what decive is using 24vac and inspect or unhook it and isolate the problem.


Jim

waiting on wife to get home with some more fuses.  can you tell what model i have by the pictures? also, there are 2 gold things that look to match up when the door is closed, what is that?

Ive determined that the long skinny connection with the arrow is the culprit, now what do I do?

that plug is J-10,  it  sends 24vac to the handle solenoid.  there is a two pin connection that goes to the handle solenoid, unplug it and now see if the fuse blows. It shouldn't blow,  the problem is probably the  bridge rectifier located on the handle solenoid, one of the diodes is shorted to ground, or there is a coin lodged somewhere around that solenoid.

the gold things you refer too?   perhaps they are the door/cabinet optics.

Jim 

it still blows when that is disconnected.  I looked for coins again and no luck. 

correction, i did not try that one, thought those wires went elsewhere.  that did it, no blown fuse.  now do i order a part and put it back together? will it work with that disconnected?

yes it will, you won't be able to pull the handle or hear the thumps associated with the reels stopping.

put it all together and hopefully everything will work.

order a handle solenoid from people who have a banner on top of the page. it can be replaced by  removing three locknuts and rotating the coil toward the front, its' not easy, but  with some effort if can be done. I do it all the time. 

Jim

ill do that today.  thanks for the help!  the "winner paid" shows 1 and the wheels keep spinning, any ideas how to clear this?

Open the door and turn the reset key once.

the wheels quit spinning but there is still a 1 in the winner paid and coins fall straight through

coins fall straight through to the tray or the hopper ??

Are you using the same size coin that is in the coin compraitor as a sample coin ??

coins inserted (quarters) fall straight through to the tray. And quarter is the coin in the coin comparitor.

FIRST OFF  lets start over from the begining. when you were at this ladys' house ,did everything work on the machine, did it accept coins, spin, payoff to credits or from the hopper?  did the bill acceptor work?  what lamps came on, 25 cent denom. lamp, insert coin, yellow back lit bill acceptor, did the handle work?

turn off the power,  turn the power back on and observe what happens.then close and latch the door closed and observe what happens.

Jim 

When I arrived i asked her to plug it in.  I inserted a quarter and used the handle, wheels spun heard sound, not a winner.  I inserted a 1$ bill and it registered credits. i played 3 credits by using the button, hit a winner that paid more than the hopper had in it.  she said when i got home i would need to put enough money in the hopper to pay that winner.  the lights worked, the handle worked, i thought everything was working fine.

when i power it on now, the bill acceptor cycles, insert coin blinks, and after 5 seconds or so a "1" is in the winner paid window.  when i insert a quarter they fall straight through to the tray.

the change, cash, bet 1, spin, play 3 credits, are not lit

have you checked the other two fuses?   if they are good, close the door and latch it in the down position, this is to ensure that the door optics align and act as a reset to the machine.  turn the jackpot reset switch and observe what happens, most changes will be on the displays, they should in effect increase each time you turn the key.  at some point the displays' will go out and then come back on as a number in the winner paid window. either seven or thirteen  turns.

when i shut and latch the door, nothing changes. no sounds or changes in the display.  same thing when i turn the key.  the number stays at 1 and nothing happens

the other 2 fuses are fine

What bothers me though is that you turn the reset key
and the machine doesn't go into the "Accounting mode"

You don't need door optics to get into the accounting mode.

does anything change when you press the white test button (near the power on/off switch)?   I would go back and make sure all the plugs are seated on the motherboard and there are no bent pins on the main logic board.

nothing at all.  I'm gonna go back and check all my connections.  i took some pics just in case something sticks out to you.

Jim  Remember one time I had this problem with a 5 reel S+, and you fixed me up.  If he had the plugs off the mother board, two are the same and can be switched.

that would just take out the displays, the rest of the machine should work.

do you have the 25 denom. lamp lit? swap with the others .  are the reels locked into place? or do they free wheel?

the reels are locked and the.25 is lit, i unplugged everything and plugged it back in with the same results

ok this time when i put the hopper back in it gives me the 3100 error and wheels started spinning

anytime you get an error with this machine you have to close the door in order to clear it,

what exactly happened to this machine from the time you left the ladys' home til' yours. did you lay it down for transport?  were there coins in the hopper?  if so, did they get behind the cover ?   this is a very durable machine, its just hard to imagine how it could go from a working state to what you have now, and no reason for it. anything you could help with would be huge.

I feel all the power is good,  if you could clear the 3100 code we should be able to get into the diagnostics.

i did lay it on its back and transported it in my truck, halfway sticking out.  it was tied down good.  probably not a great idea, but i did it.  i removed the coin hopper, bill acceptor and tray to lighten the heavy side during transport.  i can get in the diagnostics now.

the light on top was getting bent so i dissassembled it.  it is still disassembled but i disconnected it from the machine.  I really do appreciate the help.  I want to help you anyway i can.

 next check to see if the dollar bill cash box switch has been bypassed. you should see signs of it when you open the cash box door on the right hand side, two green wires should be tied together. if you can get into the diagnostics,  push the button until you can get a 10_1 in the winners paid window.  advance this (by using the jackpot key switch or the change button) this depends on what sp chip  is in the machine.   advance it until it reads 13_1,  close the door and latch the 1 should toggle to a zero and continue doing that.  if that works,  then you should be able to continue pressing the white test button and test all functions of the machine.  each number in the coins played window and a corresponding number in the winners paid window indicate a new test. 

I tied the 2 wires together in the bill acceptor box, it didn't change anything.  I talked to the people again that sold it to me and they didn't have to do anything to it, all the damage was done when i transported it.  The strange thing to me is after i got it home it paid the last jackpot and made one last spin before the problems started.

Have you tried turning the machine on with the hopper unplugged? Or better yet, disconnect the leads from the hopper motor and try it. Maybe you have a bad motor pulling the power supply down

I turned the machine off, removed the hopper, disconnected both leads to the hopper, restarted and same thing: winner paid 1, insert coin flashing, .25 lit, and 0 credits.  Turning key does nothing.

Aside from the fact that turning the key does nothing, it nearly sounds like the machine is simply waiting for a coin to be inserted.  Did the bill acceptor work, and does it now?  Does the machine attempt to accept a bill?

Where are you located?  You may be in someone's backyard who can help you in person, but you haven't indicated your location in your profile (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?action=profile;sa=forumProfile).   :71-


Also, I just want to clear a couple of other things up:

- Is the plug that was causing the fuse to blow unhooked from the motherboard, or do you just have the wires disconnected from the solenoid.  For some reason I'm thinkng that the wiring to the jackpot reset keyswitch may also be in that harness, but I could be wrong and I don't have any schematics handy.

- Is the dollar bill stacker box ("cash can") firmly inserted into the machine, and is the cash box door still firmly closed?

- To be clear, when you close and fully latch the door, you're saying that there is absolutely no change on the display at all?  When you push the latch down, the display should go blank for about 3 seconds, then return to its idle display.  Does the display go blank at all when you close the door, even for just a few seconds?

- For kicks, can you please remove and re-insert the quarter that is in the coin comparator on the backside of the main door?  Slide the piece to the right, then re-seat the quarter in there, making sure that the slide piece gets it nice and centered and seated correctly.  It's possible that the sample coin came loose during transit, which would cause all coins to be rejected.

- Finally, and I hate to say it, but it's possible that something else fried when you had a short in your machine.  On the plus side, there really isn't too much to an S+ -- just the motherboard and the removable MPU board, and both of those boards aren't terribly expensive, so even if you do wind up having to replace one or both boards, it won't set you back too much.  There's some other troubleshooting to be done, however, before we get to that point.

Hi, and Thanks.

The only time i can get the key to do anything is when the machine shows a 3100 error.  it allows me to cycle through the bookkeeping.
The bill acceptor did work.  Now, it cycles and when complete it does not accept a bill.

I updated my profile, I'm near Waco Texas.

The handle solenoid was causing the short, i simply disconnected the 2 pin connector to it.
The cash box is firmly inserted and the lock handle is pushed all the way down.

When I close the door, absolutely nothing changes, not even for a second.

checked all my connections again, and it now gives a 3100 error that i cant get rid of

Your door optics are at fault (( there's possibly more problems too ( hopper for ex.) but we must start somewhere!))
They are NOT closing the circuit to send the "door closed" signal back to the MPU.
If they worked, the "Coins Played" number would go out for about 2 seconds -
when the door latch is fully in the downward position & the door optics are fully lined up to "see" each other.
We need to run some trouble shooting with your door optics to make sure they are operational.

With a digital camera, open the door and look at the emitter optic on the door.
There should be a faint blue light when observed through a digital camera view finder.
The cabinet door receiver optic does not throw light so there's nothing to see there.

There are door optic tests that you can perform in the Output Tests.
Do you know how to do these Tests?

After further inspection i noticed that the red wire going to the optic on the machine side is not connected.  I am in the process of ordering these parts and will update when i have them installed.  I would like to thank all the generous and helpful people at NLG, for taking time out of their day to help a stranger.  I know all of you do it every day, but that doesn't make me any less thankful.  I WILL donate to the site and order my parts though one of the Banners.  Thanks again!

I cannot take full credit as you mentioned it in Reply #17. ( the "gold things"... :96-)  
Then JIM also mentioned the optics in Reply #31.
The kicker clue for me  :299- was your reply in Reply #32...>>>


"...when i shut and latch the door, nothing changes. no sounds or changes in the display."

Last night, after installing the new door optics, my machine worked just great.  I played the remaining credits it had on it and inserted a 1 dollar bill and played those 4 credits.  I left the machine on overnight.  Today the bill collector will not accept bills and coins fall straight through to the tray.  The led display are blank except for the coins played reads 0.  When i open and close the door, nothing changes on the screen and the reels do nothing. In the diagnostics, it reads 10-0, 11-0, 13-0, etc.

Heat caused this...where?  I have no idea.  :8-
Shut off the machine and let it cool down for an hour or so.
Turn it back on later and see if it works?

Is it more likely that something is ruining the door optics or that the set I bought was bad?  I think my problem is still in the door optics.

No because you had them working when you changed them.
Plus the Molex connectors only allow you to plug them into the ends of the harness one-way.

unless

You may have forgotten to put the plastic zip tie on the optics, pinched the optic wire
in the door latch cutting the wire and grounding it out against the door chassis.

THAT would ruin the emitter optic every time.

Mark Have him run a jumper wire to bypass the optics and you will know for sure if the optics are the problem.

Yeah...we gotta get him to change the "Coins Played" display to momentarily go out and come back on -
that tells ya the door optics are working.


Making a bypass is a little tough for a new guy.
I have an easier idea  :299- that might work.

jake, if you have a digital camera ( cellphone cam maybe?) open the door, turn the power on
and look at the emitter optic on the door frame next to the handle latch.
See if you can see a faint blue light shining in your viewfinder.
If so, that means your emitter optics are good!

I disconnected the optics, checked for pinched wires or bad connections.  I then reconnected everything and tried again.  I went to 13 in the diagnostics and closed and latched the door slowly, the 0 next to the 13 flashed (extremely quick) from 0 to 1 to 0 to 1 etc.  Then I opened the door and tried again and it stayed at 0.  Used my iphone camera to look in the door side optic and could not see any blue light. 

You'll only see light from one side of the optic (the transmitter) -- the reciever side won't show any light, and that trick doesn't work with 100% of digital cameras, either.

The rapid 1/0/1/0/1/0 flickering in the optics test is normal, and indicates that your optics are working correctly.

Make sure that your cash can is firmly closed, or wire the cash can switch wires together to fool the machine into thinking it is closed.

Jim had me wire those together so I should be good there.  I can't get it to flicker anymore, it stays at 0.  Maybe they got misaligned in transport and they luckily lined up a couple of times which allowed me to play?  Getting quite a few 3100 errors as well. 

Are you getting 3100 errors when the game is trying to pay out, or just randomly during gameplay?

If you can't get the optics test to alternate between 1/0 anymore, then you'll never get the game working.  Either the optics are bad again, there's a problem with the wiring, there's another door open (or your wires that are twisted together for the cash can came undone), or there's something wrong with your MPU board.

I don't like getting into Bunker's thread, but here goes.

Jake Take a Sharpie pen and make a line that lines up with the optics on the door, do the same thing on the cabnet side.  Close the door and the two Sharpie black lines MUST line up. If they don't, adjust the cabnet side until it does line up. ( You will have to make a new mark on cabnet side after you adjust the optic )  WD 40 will remove the black mark after you finish.

That's not normal.  sounds as if your losing a ground to the optics. somethings to try!
1. there is a wire in the back of the machine, blue/w green tracer, right hand side wire bundle behind the meters and on/off  switch (reels area of machine) ground this wire to the metal frame anywhere, should have a pronged connector on it. see if this fixes your problem.
2. check and see if there is a belly door switch, if so bypass this as you did the cash can switch.
3. remove coin tray, hopper, power machine, get to the 13_0 test, close door, If optics not working(constant zero on display,opposed to a changing 1/0) reach into machine and start wiggling the connectors on the motherboard while observing the display, pay attention to J-10 , I think this is where the ground for this circuit comes from. if you get a change, then address that area.

Jim


(Fixed a broken quote tag. -knagl)

Buzz's suggestion for lining up the door optics is the best I've seen here!  :89-

Jim,
I wonder if he has electrical tape protecting the cash can wires?
Maybe they're grounding out onto the metal of the cabinet?

I have a question though...is the 2-wire harness on your door emitter optic have the colors Black and Red?
The receiver optic 2-wire harness on the cabinet should have the colors of Red and White!
If they are backwards...they will burn out.

Below is a photo from one of my S+'s to show you how the door emitter optic should be installed along
with it's plastic tie - preventing movement of the 2-wire optic harness.
That harness is extremely fragile as it is soldered to some very small contact wires extruding from
the emitter lamp and will break very, very easily!

Click on the photograph to enlarge!...>>>

I did the sharpie trick and my optics are lined up great.  (Place a piece of clear tape on the machine before you draw the line and no need for wd40)

I tied the cash can wires together per Jim and they are well taped.  I also grounded the blue/green wire awhile back so that's not it either. 

I used a panasonic digital camera, and I CAN see light coming out of the right side of the optic.

So far I haven't noticed any changes in the display when I wiggle the wires on the motherboard (it's difficult to look at it while reaching in the machine)

If i remove the door optic bracket from the machine on both sides and hold the optics together as if the door was closed, I still do not get a change on the display.

That's even better! Good idea on top of another good idea!  :3-


Well that sucks the biggie.... :8- I would have tried that too.
What spare parts do you have?
A motherboard? Another MPU? Another set of optics?
No matter what I say now's gonna cost you some money.  :56- (Need a smiliey burning cash in a fire...lol )
Without spare parts - you can't do any swapping to pinpoint the problem.

Have you tried JIM's suggestions yet?

I did all of Jim's suggestions and I have no parts.  It's becoming an expensive decoration lol!  Do you know of anyone in Texas I could take it to?

Oh man!
There' a whole bunch of NLGers's right near you!
Look at the member's map! Have you pinned yours yet?...>>>

http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?action=googlemap (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?action=googlemap)

Man, what a marathon post!! Rivoting, up to the minute, play by play action!! Like S+ 101 & 202 all in one post!!  :3- :3- :3-

Then he just disappeared and left us hanging...we'll never know the ending now.  :103-

 :259- :259- :259- :259- to Jim, Stayout, Buzz, knagl, and cowboy and anyone else I might have missed...

How awful of me to do y'all like that!

I gave up and carried it to a shop that is going to do what he can.  He replace the battery as soon as I for there.  Found out the optics would work if you touched them together but never when the door was closed.  I bought an s2000 without a coin hopper, but that's part of the fun, so I'm going to add a hopper so you may be hearing from me real soon!  Right now it pays out in tickets but the machine won't accept them, any way around that?

S2000s (and any machine with a TITO system) require a backroom computer server to validate and accept tickets. Up until about a year ago it was impossible for home users to have such a system. Now, though, some smart folks have hacked together a way to do this at home. Check out this section of the forum for more information:

 http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?board=105.0

I'd stay away from the thread with 477 replies unless you REALLY want to do it! lol
Lost a lotta sleep on that one... :47-

I better stick to the hopper route!