IGT ?????????

[poppo]

Jim, here is a better pic of the plug in on the logic MPU board in question, still look "not normal"?

I think the picture is just making it look distorted (like the bottom is bowed up at the ends). But if the bottoms of the connectrors are not actually parallel, then you have a problem. Did you check for bent pins?

In any case, it looks like you may have a problem with your 7vac and need to figure out why. You don't need the MPU or hopper in while working on tracking that down.

If you have 7vac on that white plug going to the motherboard, then you need to find out why it's not getting to the LED board. Once agian, you may need to unplug and inspect evey connector and make sure there are no bent pins and they are all seated good. All it takes is one pin not making contact to kill the machine.

[straycat]

Just to make sure I have my Meter rite here is a pic of the settings, I know this is very basic to you all but when you don't use one of these on a regular bases it confuses me! Also a pic of the White power plug "unplugged" from board. I am getting conflicting reading compareing to schematic posted, what is the rite way to test this plug. Don't be afraid of using "really laymen words"!
I have looked and found no bent pin's.......................................................

[poppo]

You had the meter right. Standby on the readings you should get. I think Tilt may have posted the wrong pin to pin readings as they don't match the schematic.

Be sure to check F2 again.

Note the pin numbers on the schematic are are not in sequential order. Pin #1 is the one on the right side of the plug in your picture. To confirm, you should have 24vac across 5-6.

I went ahead and measured mine and this is what I get
1-3 7vac
2-4 8vac
5-6 24vac

Note: These readings were taken with the plug connected to the motherboard (but no MPU). The motherboard ties the commons 1-2 together (I verified this). Without the plug being connected, the readings mayl be screwy since the windings are seperate.

[straycat]

Just ready to post the "screwy" numbers till I seen your update, will go back and do it again with it plugged in. Might have to stand on my head for this test!
F2 still good.................

Your schematic shows the same values as Tilt's, but pin selection is diff.?

[straycat]

Completed test as follows with White plug plugged into mother board, no MPU.
1-3   8.9 VAC
2-4   7.6 VAC
5-6   8.6 VAC        With White plug unplugged from mother board I get 28.5 from 5-6 ...............

[poppo]

Completed test as follows with White plug plugged into mother board, no MPU.
1-4  7.6 VAC
2-3  1.2 VAC
5-6  8.6 VAC         Looks like 5-6 that should be 24 is only 1/3 working!  When I check 5-6 with plug unplugged I get 29.6

NOW WHAT?

Hmmm...... 5-6 dropping that low when plugged in AND 2-3 reading low, looks like something may be shorted on that 7vac line causing the 24vac to drop. Or the power supply may have issues. However, I have been lucky and never had to mess with the power supply and am only going by the schematics. Hopefully someone else can help out more in that area. Plus your machine is a little different having the exposed transformer.

In any case your readings are not normal. Did you check for loose coins everywhere as Jim mentioned? You may want to unscrew the motherboard and remove it and look underneath it.

On a side note and not to confuse you, but maybe someone else knows. According to the S+ schematics, if pins 1-2 of J8 on the motherboard are tied together (and they are), that would mean pins 4-5 of J110 are tied together. But that would also mean the windings on the top half of the transofmer are shorted which would cause much smoke. So something is not quite right with the schematics.

[straycat]

Poppo, I edited my post from the one you qouted as I did the first one wrong. Look at my revised values. Still the 5-6 is not rite plugged in ..................
Yes, checked for quarterts found none dang it!
And yes, lifted mother board and all looked real nice under there!

[Tilt]

Getting ready to board my flight to Houston.  Real quick, I think you may have been using the wrong reference for your measurements.

From pin 5 to 1 your should have 7VAC
From pin 5 to 6 you should have 8 VAC
From pin 4 to 2 you should have 12 VAC
From pin 4 to 3 you should have 12 VAC

Tilt, I got those reading from the red box in the schematics you posted on reply 18, that is not the correct readings printed or maybe  the wrong schematics?

Yeah, sorry.  In my haste to send a reply before hopping on the plane I gave you the pinouts and voltages for the P110 side of that cable (opposite end of it).  Sorry for the confusion.

[poppo]

Poppo, I edited my post from the one you qouted as I did the first one wrong. Look at my revised values. Still the 5-6 is not rite plugged in ..................

Ok, so something is causing the 24vac to drop when plugged in but with no MPU. Hmmm...I need to go look at the schematics again.

ok, here are all of the plugs that the 24Vac goes to. You may try unpugging all of them from the motherboard, then recheck 5-6. If it's ok, you can try plugging them in one at a time and see which one causes it to drop. Although I would think that anything causing it to drop that much would blow the fuse.  

Note: The first one is the MPU, so don't worry about that one since the MPU is already out. You may not have a cable in every one listed.

[straycat]

AS if your head isn't spinning enough from my lame diagnoses I have a Correction, I lifted the MPU not the mother board and it all looked great. Tomorrow morn I will check the bottom of the mother board and report back............

Tilt, not a problem, love all the info I can get and believe it or not I do learn even if it's "suspect" info. Just knowing I questioned it is a move forward for me!

Poppo, makes sence, will try that in the morn and report back. Thanks!

On the PinBall machines I fixed I remember " voltage check points" on the circit boards, sure made it easier! Course having the rite schematics in front of me also helped......................

[poppo]

After looking at the schematics, I see that the 24vac does not go to too many places that your machine uses it.

You are not using:
J2
J5
J6
J9
J11 (it does not look like you have a bell)

So, barring finding a coin shorting under the the motherboard that only leaves:
J1
J5 (meters)
J10

Be sure to check the pins in J10. It's sort of back in the corner and might easier to get one bent.

Also, while not directly related to the 24vac, it looks like there was some work done on your motherboard at some point. At least one resistor appears to have been replaced. When you pull it up, inspect the bottom carefully for bad solder jobs.

[crashed86]

something does not look right on the xformer schematic shown. I just spent the last 3 days tracking down a voltage issue on a 96 S+ machine and that is how I discovered the multitude of varying schematics. Verify how the terminals on secondary side of xformer are labeled. they are either 3-8 or 4-9. depending how they are numbered determines which schematic to use. I have now seen 3 differant schematics for S+ power supplies. page 59 of IGT S+ manual section 9, pages 69-72 of the players edge plus and S+ electronic repair manual (1994) and the schematic posted above. you need to determine which one applies to your machine. this may be why things are not measuring the way they should. Remember, for engineers it always works on paper, but humans built these things.
I wrote up a troubleshooting flow chart based on what I did to track down the issue on my machine. But I dont want to post it here if it may not apply to your situation.

[Jim]

I know I asked this before,and after looking at the fuse panel, I have to ask that you check the continuity thru each fuse holder. the top one looks like it has been modified to apply pressure to hold the fuse in ?  the way to do this--  there is a wire going in to the fuse and a wire coming out of the fuse place the meter leads on each wire, with the meter set to measure resistance(ohms), if all is well you should read basically a short across all three fuses if the fuse and holder are good.  this will eliminate any confusion as to the power getting to where it should be.


Jim

[straycat]

crashed86, I will check that out first thing, I can see where I could be chasing my tail using the wrong schematics info. Thanks.

Jim, was hoping no one would see that! When I was first checking fuses that one had broken holder tabs so not having any parts at the moment to keep testing I made a little clip/bracket to keep tension on it. When I get a parts list of things I will need I will be asking "where" to get them! I will check fuses with or method. Thanks

Jim, will have that board out in a little while for inspection. I find all this relaxing in a way but very time consuming at the same time, gotta get some chores done around the house than sneak away back to the slot................

A freind of mine came over the other day and was so excited to see a slot machine in person, know how many people haven't even seen or touched a slot? Anyway he wants one (among other things) now for his new man cave so I have posted on the classifieds a WTB in the WA. OR. ID. are. Maybe you guys have slot friends in the Pacific North West that may have one for sale? He's really looking for an older '30z '40z' 50z '60z '70z Art Deco type.  Thanks again to all, Lon

[Jim]

the end result of the wiring is this! J-8 on the motherboard Pin 1 starts toward the rear of the machine.pin 1 is a green wire,it is 7/8vac common, pin2 is a green wire, it is the 7/8 vac common, pin 3 is a blue wire  7vac, pin 4 is a brown/blue wire  8vac, pin5 is orange/green wire it is 24 vac hot, pin 6 is orange wire it is 24 vac return.

the wiring from the transformer:  on the right side 3 posts. 1=white/red ac common, 2= black/red 115vac hot,  3= black/violet 220vac.

on the left side 6 posts, three on the front ,three on the rear. Orange/black wire to F-1 6amp fuse ,out of the fuse as a orange/green to pin 5 of p-8, green wire directly to pin 1 on p-8, orange wire directly to pin6 of p-8, blue/black to F-2 8amp fuse comes out as a green wire to pin 2 of p-8, blue wire directly to Pin 3 of p-8, brown/blue to pin4  on p-8.
the resistor in question R-3 is a 3.9 ohm resistor   one side of the denomination lamp pad goes directly to the 7vac hot, the other side goes to R-3, thru R-3 and to Bgrnd.this could be why you don't read a voltage there. something could be wrong in that area. 
the best way to test the 24vac being dragged down is this: hook up your meter leads to pins 5/6 of P-8 .Push them into the top this will usually hold them for this test. plug into J-8 on the motherboard. apply power and observe the voltage, if it is down, turn off power. remove the board, apply power, observe meter if voltage is still down shut off power. remove all the plugs  going to the motherboard,(exceptP-8) apply power , observe meter see if the voltage stays at 24vac, if it does,  then turn off power insert one plug at a time and perform the same procedure until you find the one that is holding down the 24 vac.

Jim