"S" style Pro Slot 5500 bally (plum crazy game) reel problem

[versterk]

Thank you for reading my post 

first of all, my name is clement, I m living in France, about 40 years old, two sons, a great wife, some races with my kawasaki atv ...

from '86 to '96 I used to repair cbm 64 and amiga computers and I recently bought a bally 5500 proslot machine.

This slot was working well 8 years ago at a friend living near me( I played some hours with it in 2003) but its battery failed ( code 81) and it was left to the cellar until now.

last week I took it back to life and it still shown 81 error code. I changed battery, then error code 83F , then cleared saferam with successfully jw10 method (mpu seems to be built in '94 ?) but now , some strange things appear :

all reel are working well during all test manipulations (except payout test #10 , false everytime, reel strips never moved)

bill acceptor was unplugged today, as I can t use it with EUR bills

If I spin reels with pseudo coin test , everything is okay ( except payout values)

everything was cleaned from A to Z (opto and mechanics)

BUT when I want to play ,power on and waiting for ready state,  I put three coins and spin, everything go right , I win, I lose , no matter, I spin again and then error code 41 come at each second spin !!!!

of course I swapped reel 1 with 2 then 3 and 3 with 2 , some times error code 42 appears too but never related with one reel in particular... (thinking of bus error with pals or mc68000..?)

I open the door ( code 50 appears, nothing abnormal), then close it,my game restart, I spin , everything go right, I spin again and then crash again 

so if someone know why I can only spin once before crash on second and why now payout values are false ?

eproms are : U12 ME920000-c1 / U15 ME920000-c0 / U3 SE920000-c3 / U4 SE920000-c2
U18 / U20 seem to are not original ones ( stickers are "new") , wrote on it PLUM CRAZY 6987 ( but MPU case has SMI 7540 sticked on it)
when I changed battery , I noticed that ram on U68 was bad plugged ( one row was unplugged)

I didn't use clear chips ( why clear chips ...? are they filled with special code or only with 0 ?)

I have everything at home for reading, dumping,erasing,programming eproms like 27xxx

hope I gave you all clues for helping me ...?

thanking you in advance for any help ( and for reading all my post  )

faithfully

clement



(pictures can be found in my profile)

[CaptainHappy]

Thank you for reading my post 

first of all, my name is clement, I m living in France, about 40 years old, two sons, a great wife, some races with my kawasaki atv ...

from '86 to '96 I used to repair cbm 64 and amiga computers and I recently bought a bally 5500 proslot machine.

This slot was working well 8 years ago at a friend living near me( I played some hours with it in 2003) but its battery failed ( code 81) and it was left to the cellar until now.

last week I took it back to life and it still shown 81 error code. I changed battery, then error code 83F , then cleared saferam with successfully jw10 method (mpu seems to be built in '94 ?) but now , some strange things appear :

all reel are working well during all test manipulations (except payout test #10 , false everytime, reel strips never moved)

bill acceptor was unplugged today, as I can t use it with EUR bills

If I spin reels with pseudo coin test , everything is okay ( except payout values)

everything was cleaned from A to Z (opto and mechanics)

BUT when I want to play ,power on and waiting for ready state,  I put three coins and spin, everything go right , I win, I lose , no matter, I spin again and then error code 41 come at each second spin !!!!

of course I swapped reel 1 with 2 then 3 and 3 with 2 , some times error code 42 appears too but never related with one reel in particular... (thinking of bus error with pals or mc68000..?)

I open the door ( code 50 appears, nothing abnormal), then close it,my game restart, I spin , everything go right, I spin again and then crash again 

so if someone know why I can only spin once before crash on second and why now payout values are false ?

eproms are : U12 ME920000-c1 / U15 ME920000-c0 / U3 SE920000-c3 / U4 SE920000-c2
U18 / U20 seem to are not original ones ( stickers are "new") , wrote on it PLUM CRAZY 6987 ( but MPU case has SMI 7540 sticked on it)
when I changed battery , I noticed that ram on U68 was bad plugged ( one row was unplugged)

I didn't use clear chips ( why clear chips ...? are they filled with special code or only with 0 ?)

I have everything at home for reading, dumping,erasing,programming eproms like 27xxx

hope I gave you all clues for helping me ...?

thanking you in advance for any help ( and for reading all my post  )

faithfully

clement



(pictures can be found in my profile)

Welcome! I am sure that one of our great Bally experts will be able to get you up and running. You have come to the right place!

CaptainHappy

[StatFreak]

First, Clement


920000 Mains don't need clear chips, so that's fine. They are required with later Mains versions. However, you do need to close jumper JW10 for the clear and open it afterwards. Sounds like you know what you're doing, but keep in mind that when pressing the pseudo coin and test buttons that you must press HARD – I mean that your fingers should hurt. If you got the CH C message after power up and it changed to CL C after releasing the buttons then you did it right.

Did you make sure that all of the switches and jumpers on the MPU board are correct for your game?
They probably are, but again, keep in mind that if they were accidentally or deliberately changed at some point, those changes wouldn't take effect until the machine were cleared, which is what you did right before the problems started. (In other words, something might have been changed years ago, but you wouldn't know it until you performed a clear.)


Regarding the reel tilt errors:
If the problem clearly isn't following the reels OR the harness (you didn't specify whether you checked for this), then the problem might be on the MPU board. Since it worked before, I would first carefully check the pins that plug into the back plane to be sure that none are bent/broken. For giggles, I would also pull and re-seat all of the connectors.

Regarding the incorrect payouts:
Bally S5500's don't have a setting for slant top vs. upright. Both positions are available on the strips/reels, so just doing a clear shouldn't put the reels out of alignment. Enter either test #5 or #6. When the reels first index at the beginning of each test, the "seams" should all be lined up on the center payline.

If they line up, it wouldn't hurt to just run each of those tests through to see if you get any errors.


StatFreak
  Global Moderator

[versterk]

thank you friends for your help 

harness tested , seems to be ok , every chip on socket , has been unplugged and re-plugged
no pin were bent nor on connectors
all test work, no crash, no bug , except always bad values as if rolls were not in correct place 

in case I ll must change the MPU board, where can I find a great dealer ?
shall s6000 MPU boards will work too ?

have a great day

and thank you again

[StatFreak]

thank you friends for your help 

harness tested , seems to be ok , every chip on socket , has been unplugged and re-plugged
no pin were bent nor on connectors
all test work, no crash, no bug , except always bad values as if rolls were not in correct place 

in case I ll must change the MPU board, where can I find a great dealer ?
shall s6000 MPU boards will work too ?

have a great day

and thank you again

I didn't just mean to look for damage to the harness, although that's important. Did you test to see if the reel tilt errors followed a particular harness (instead of checking to see if the tilt followed the reels.)

When you say, "all test work, no crash, no bug," does that mean that the three reels spun to their seams in the tests I mentioned?  If so, then you probably have the wrong strips for your chips and need to either buy the right strips, or buy a set of chips to match the strips you have (as long as the strips match the glass.)

[versterk]

Statfreak

today I looked at the following : testing each pin trough the harness, specially reel 1 from 1 to 10
I tested #7 reel tilts ( according to the bally manual) @ 075d in "win paid" I got 2 in "credit"
but what do bally means by 'running improperly ? is stepped motors in cause ?

there s something really strange , this machine worked 8 years ago , nothing has been modified during 8 years (keys were lost) and now reel strips seem not according the roms ???
I found that it does exist a smi documentation to check #6 test ? what does it contains ? pictures ? numbers ?

I have looked also schematics and diagram to looked at chips controlling reels (page 14-23 / 9-3 / 14-19 / 14-9) thinking of bad U14 and/or u16 ( 74hc244 & 74hc273) ... ?

I hope there s no PAL problem?

...

shall I post a video of the first 3 minutes after power on ? it will help ?

best regards from France ;-)

[paul]

looking at your the dips are not set right

[Buzz]

David don't forget Bally have the two notches on the strips.

[versterk]

here are the news for today

switch ram chips together u67/u68
changed motorola cpu (amiga have the same)
redo the saferam clear procedure

start on the engine and got 43 about 4 ou 5 times in same conditions, and then after many reset got back 41 

but there is something strange on the mpu board ... how can we have a 1994 mpu board with roms from this date and many chips soldered built in 1998 ???

@buzz strips are in right (slant) position
@paul dip are set as origin

[StatFreak]

David don't forget Bally have the two notches on the strips.

Buzz, if you were talking to me, I asked him twice to run tests  5 & 6 to check reel strip position and he didn't report the results.



At this point though, versterk should concentrate on fixing the problem causing the reel tilts before worrying about the strip positions.

[versterk]

statfreak , results on test 5 and 6 are if i had bad strip , nothing is right, but strips are on good position, I tried also to look inside the slot , as if it was an upright model, nothing correspond
everything resulting as if chips and strips wasnt done for each others
but this f....g slot machine worked 8 years ago

in theory if three plum are aligned in test 6 , I should get a jackpot ( so 2000 coins) right ?

for sure It s an educationnal problem ( sorry if its not really correct)

supposing , strip could be arranged later, there s also something really strange ... can duart on board be deffective ?

thank for all of you :-)

[versterk]

here is a video , I won 100 coins without any coherence with strips
and the slot worked exceptionnally 2 times before crashing...
enjoy ;-)
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/ziaN1WM4M5Q&rel=0" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/ziaN1WM4M5Q&rel=0</a>

[CYRIL1973]

 Hi,

You certainly did not respect the order of the reels.

Try to swap them.

As for the 41 troubleshooting, you have to change your reels.

Cyril

[cowboygames]

Cyril's probably right. After sitting in the "cellar" for 8 years I wouldn't be surprised at all to find there was a problem with one or more of the reel stepper motors causing them to "slide" into an error when they stop

[versterk]

friends, as explained before , reels are in their right places as they were 8 years ago, before cleaning them, I ve marked them to be sure of their palces... same thing with strips , they all are in correct "slant" index...

for eeror code 41 as said before, reel 1 was tested  in thrid place , if it was "bad" Bally should print error code 43 ... but none always 41 ( some time, rarely it print 43 and one time 42 with nothing modified before) harness has been tested , not cut no disfunction... "de quoi s arracher les cheveux" as we should say in France ))
symptom let me think a pal or logic chip has some bugs and reels and mpu are misunderstanding themselves


@cowboygames : it could be an idea,I think that leaving this board and reels during 8 years alone made bad things, but I never seen on a computer based machine something like this, generally bad contacts give random results,but  I always have the same problems in same cases ... one time it works, then it crash, one time it works , then it crash ...

I will take some days in hollidays , it will cool my brain 

[StatFreak]

If you're sure that the reels and the harness are good then the next logical step is to replace the MPU board. A component failure or other failure on the board can cause reel tilts. Once the tilts are fixed we'll look at the strips.