Help finding the right chip

[poppo]

So, any chance of seeing how that BV is connected? Obviously it has a power cable. But where do the other cables go?

[Mirage_Chaser]

I will try to track and include pictures for the ba harness, the backplane is also an s+ part. It appears to be just a really big S or S+. The machine came from IGT so I don't know about it being a bally.

[StatFreak]

Knagl, that particular Bertha is a Bally, but even so, it might be possible to replace the Cashcode with a more modern DBV or WBA if the entire machine is an S+.
Mirage_Chaser, are the rest of the components besides the MPU the same as an S+? ( i.e., the motherboard, basic harness (I/O) configuration, etc.?)
...

I will try to track and include pictures for the ba harness, the backplane is also an s+ part. It appears to be just a really big S or S+. The machine came from IGT so I don't know about it being a bally.

You misunderstood. The picture of the Big Bertha that knagl mentioned had a PE+ DBV was a Bally. I was referring to that picture.

It can't be an S if it is using an S+ MPU board and has an S+ motherboard. The S doesn't even have a motherboard. What I meant by "the entire machine"  being an S+ was that I don't know if your Big Bertha has any custom components not found in a regular S+.

[Mirage_Chaser]

Oh sorry for my confusion...

Here are the pictures I have so far of the harness
pic 1 is of the harness coming from the bottom of BA going to the meter board and the plug which heads down the door
pic 2 is j6 where half of the wires go (the one with the multimeter probe stuck in it) and on the right the 2 power wires going into the ps

[Mirage_Chaser]

Still think this might all be for naught if I can't enable the ba

[poppo]

Still think this might all be for naught if I can't enable the ba

Thats what we are trying to help do. But we need to make sure we are not on a wild goose chase if this BV is a 'hack' add on. It must be some sort of kludge because it's taking the bills and is does not appear to be dependent on the MPU telling it to turn on like a 'normal' BV.

pic 2 is j6 where half of the wires go

Where do the other half go?

[TZtech]

Possible alternative solution

Remove the EEPROM from the original faulty backplane board without damaging it (Its a 8 pin chip so should be do able).
Remove EEPROM from current motherboard and replace with 8 pin ic socket and put in EEPROM from original machine.

It should now update your processor board with the original settings.

BTW what eprom numbers does it report in test mode?

Ian

[poppo]

Possible alternative solution

Remove the EEPROM from the original faulty backplane board without damaging it (Its a 8 pin chip so shoul be do able).
Remove EEPROM from current motherboard and replace with 8 pin ic socket and put in EEPROM from original machine.

That would definitely work if it's a set chip related setting.

[knagl]

Knagl, that particular Bertha is a Bally

It is?    Are you sure about that, StatFreak?

I see the button deck is slightly different, but everything else appears to be the same as the other machines pictured (and the machine in question).  Are you letting the Ballys Las Vegas signage on it mislead you by chance?

[Mirage_Chaser]

Where do the other half go?

Well 2 go to power and that leaves 4 and I am not really sure yet where they go... They are much harder to track down.

Possible alternative solution

Remove the EEPROM from the original faulty backplane board without damaging it (Its a 8 pin chip so should be do able).
Remove EEPROM from current motherboard and replace with 8 pin ic socket and put in EEPROM from original machine.

It should now update your processor board with the original settings.

BTW what eprom numbers does it report in test mode?

And alas the old backplane is nowhere to be had... Someone saw melted board and chucked it.

I am not familiar with the test mode, how do I find the test mode eprom number?

[knagl]

I am not familiar with the test mode, how do I find the test mode eprom number?

Here are directions:

http://www.newlifegames.net/spset/SPSS.htm

I suspect that it'll show you the 0055 and RS3050 that we already know from the label, but I guess it couldn't hurt.

And yes I am in Antigua, are you familiar with it knagl?

Not at all -- just an educated guess. 

[Mirage_Chaser]

Those directions were nice and easy to follow... but it didn't work... I cycled through the menu more than once and 4 never comes up. Just one more thing to pile on top of this heap.

[poppo]

I am not familiar with the test mode, how do I find the test mode eprom number?

I'm not sure if this will work with your RC chip. But here is what he was talking about.

http://www.newlifegames.net/spset/SPSS.htm

Well 2 go to power and that leaves 4 and I am not really sure yet where they go... They are much harder to track down.

As already mentioned, just trying to determine if this BV is somehow tied into the coin-in mechenism. That is why we are wanting to know where the wiring goes.

The only other option I can think of, since you no longer have the original EEPROM is to use a clear chip. Then put a set of similar S+ chips in there. For example a Double Diamond SS reel chip and SP chip. Don't worry about the reels not matching or anything as we are just doing this temporarily. Then using your set chip, enable the BV and denomination. If the set chip still won't boot, then you have another problem.

If it does boot with the set chip and you have enabled the BV and set the denomination, you should be able to test the BV for adding credits. If it still does not add credits then it would indicate that the BV adds credits a different way (i.e. the coin mech) or is just broken. If it does work, then you can put your RS chip back in and hope that the BV stays enabled (it usually will if the game type is similar enough).

[stayouttadabunker]

 
This is an excellent way to go Poppo!   

I was looking at the picture and outlined in a yellow rectangle a couple of things that I have questions about.

In the smaller left outline, I see what appears to be bare wire pins
coming out of the back of the black Molex connector.
It looks to me that the plastic tie wrap is tugging on it.
Make sure those bare pins are NOT touching each other at all. (Possible shorting...?)
It could very account for some of the problems you're having?
I'd cut that tie wrap or move it back a bit and push those
bare wire pins back into the connector housing if possible.

In the 2nd rectangle on the right hand side near the button deck, I see that
there's a specially made IGT board (ASSY No.7690860) that has a relay on it towards the top center of it.
That is very unusual to see.

Not really know anything about that board as I've never seen before -
what would be that relay's function for? And is it operable and working?
Also, should there be anything plugged into the "J1" 2-pin header on that board?
Is there a loose/hanging 2-pin female connector laying around in there that we cannot see in your photograph?

Click on the photo to enlarge it or open link in a new window...>>>

 

[poppo]

Something else that still has me puzzled and is bugging me, is why won't the machine boot with the set chip? 

I've already asked about BV units on S machines, but did those machines even have a EEPROM? I though there was no motherboard on a S machine.

What I am getting at is that if a RS chip does not even support a BV in the code (or use a EEPROM) perhaps the EEPROM on this new motherboard is bad. The S+ MPU with a RS chip would not error out (bad eeprom) if the RS chip isn't even trying to talk to it. However, the SET chip would probably not boot if it was bad. But if the RS chip doesn't use ithe EEPROM, then it doesn't matter anyway. 

Just another thought, and another reason I think it might be a good idea to see if the machine can be gotten up and running with a set of 'normal' S+ chips first.

There are so many variables and unkowns here. 

[stayouttadabunker]

I agree Poppo...maybe we need to go to Antigua! lol

I'd be pulling connectors and cleaning the crap outta them trying to
remove all the oxidization from the pins with contact cleaner spray.
I'm also suspecting horrible contacts with all that black tape and shrink wrap near the motherboard.
A cleaner machine at all contact points may give us better results and a functioning machine!

[Mirage_Chaser]

I was looking at the picture and outlined in a yellow rectangle a couple of things that I have questions about.

In the smaller left outline, I see what appears to be bare wire pins
coming out of the back of the black Molex connector.
It looks to me that the plastic tie wrap is tugging on it.
Make sure those bare pins are NOT touching each other at all. (Possible shorting...?)
It could very account for some of the problems you're having?
I'd cut that tie wrap or move it back a bit and push those
bare wire pins back into the connector housing if possible.

In the 2nd rectangle on the right hand side near the button deck, I see that
there's a specially made IGT board (ASSY No.7690860) that has a relay on it towards the top center of it.
That is very unusual to see.

Not really know anything about that board as I've never seen before -
what would be that relay's function for? And is it operable and working?
Also, should there be anything plugged into the "J1" 2-pin header on that board?
Is there a loose/hanging 2-pin female connector laying around in there that we cannot see in your photograph?

The board is a meter board and it does tick when a bill is inserted even though the credits don't show upon the machine. As for the 2 pin connector there is nothing I can see to plug into it. Keep in mind that nothing has changed on that side of things and it did work before the board change.

I am going to double check the lose pins and make sure there is no shorts.

Also I am going to try and find a different backplane to try out as maybe that is a bad e2 and that is why it wont boot with the set chip in.

[StatFreak]

Another member suggested this question.

Can you verify that the picture you posted (below) is a picture of the board that is in the working machine now, and that it's working just as pictured?

[Mirage_Chaser]

Another member suggested this question.

Can you verify that the picture you posted (below) is a picture of the board that is in the working machine now, and that it's working just as pictured?

Yes and yes. That picture is from the day I posted it (yesterday or the day before) and everything is working except for the ba as far as I can tell. I can drop a few coins in and it spins...

[poppo]

Also I am going to try and find a different backplane to try out as maybe that is a bad e2 and that is why it wont boot with the set chip in.

If the EEPROM was bad, the machine would give a 65_0 error (at least with standard SP chips).  But we are just speculating because of the odd configuration. The RS chip may not even be using the EEPROM.

Instead of swapping the motherboard again, why not just try a clear and set of standard SS and SP chips as suggested above? A lot can be determined if you go that route since it will then be a 'normal' S+ MPU setup.  

Heck, if you have a know good S+ MPU handy with any game already installed (SS and SP chips) , you could plug it in and check the BV. And it would let you know if the EEPROM was bad.

[StatFreak]

Before he does that, has anyone here ever tried installing a 3-reel SP/SS setup in a game with four reels and a 4-reel harness?

[Mirage_Chaser]

So your saying put in a different S+ board that has a ba and see if it works? I am used to s2000's so this might not be the case but won't that cause a mismatch error?

[StatFreak]

So your saying put in a different S+ board that has a ba and see if it works? I am used to s2000's so this might not be the case but won't that cause a mismatch error?

Forget all that for a minute.

The reason that I asked the previous question was just to verify that you were able to use the RS chip in the machine with that board and to be sure that you weren't showing us the old board from the back room.

However, after looking at that board more carefully I have a suggestion.

The RS chip is a 256k chip and your jumpers are properly set for a 256k chip. The SET chip is a 512k chip. Try the SET015 again, but this time move the jumper on E15 and E16 from the inner two pins to the outer two pins (E15 and blank). This jumper is located right above and to the left of the top of the Game chip socket. (The picture above is upside down, so it's below and to the right in the picture.)

Let us know if that works. Either way, don't forget to put the jumper back to the 256k position (on E15 and E16) when you put the RS chip back in.


StatFreak

[poppo]

However, after looking at that board more carefully I have a suggestion.

The RS chip is a 256k chip and your jumpers are properly set for a 256k chip. The SET chip is a 512k chip. Try the SET015 again, but this time move the jumper on E15 and E16 from the inner two pins to the outer two pins (E15 and blank). This jumper is located right above and to the left of the top of the Game chip socket.

Why didn't I think of that? Oh wait...

Anyone know what size the RS chips are? What about that jumper by the game chip. Maybe it's set for a smaller size eprom than the set chip you are using (because it's a S chip).

[Mirage_Chaser]

That seems like a great idea I will give it a try right now.