Help with S2000 vision sound

[stayouttadabunker]

Hey! Good job with the video clip! 

Can you tell us what DSV SIMM sound card is installed in your machine on the MPU board?

I'll be honest with you though - It sounds like your sounds are being generated from the topbox computer.
( I can definitely hear the special Cash Advance symbol sounds. )
Was there a different kit installed in the machine before this game?
Can you get into the menu for the machine sounds and turn it up a couple of notches?
You understand that there are two separate volume settings right?
Maybe that will allow you to hear the "Ding, dong" Max Bet sounds.
I do think that the "ding,dong" sounds are generated from the machine rather than the topbox computer.

Do you get a different sound when you press the Spin button because...
you are only using the "Play 3 Credits" button in the video clip.
Also, the 1st time you pressed the "Play 3 Credits" button, I think I heard a "click,click sound...
however, what was said by whom as you pressed the "Play 3 Credits" button the 2nd time?
It sounded to me like a "voice" said something????
The 3rd time you pressed the "Play 3 Credits" button, I heard the "Click, click" sound.
I think the "Play 3 Credits" button sounds are "alternating"?

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/qogTLVANZzo&rel=0" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/qogTLVANZzo&rel=0</a>

[Jake777]

Thanks bunker
I will try to answer all the questions, I am new to s2000 and know basic componets but what or where is the DSV-Simm card?

Don't know the history of the machine but doubt that it has had a game change or kit installed

I will try your suggestion of turning up both vol and see what happens

Yes I do here ding dong sound when spin button is pushed (used one credit at a time)

In the video you did here click,click,click when max button is used ( sorry for the background noise family talking or TV) on second push. The click click sounds familiar to the meters in the machine when counting "coin in" tic,tic,tic

I have heard the dong ding from the max button, but it is faint and very seldom when I hear it. I will try the vol suggestion and post back with the results.

[stayouttadabunker]

Yes,
The Vision setup has 2 separate volume controls.
Try raising the volume on the machine's menu volume setting
and lowering the volume a bit for the LCD computer sounds.

A DSV ( Digital Sound Vehicule?) SIMM sound card looks similar to the old memory sticks we used
to see in our older desktop computers back in the late 90's.
However, your Vision machine may not have a DSV card or the piggyback board  called a MMLBII (Multi-Media Lite Board Two)
There is another piggyback MMLB version called MMLB1 (multi-media lite board version One.) but that board is rarely used and needs eprom chips for sound storage.
I doubt your game uses that at all.
These "piggyback" boards get installed on to machine's main MPU board.

Your machine probably relies on most of the game sounds from
the topbox computer CF flash card that is inserted into the top slot.
However, SOME of the basic machine sounds rely on the basic ( generic) sounds that a machine 's MPU has stored internally.

Note: If I've made any mistakes guys...please inform me and I will edit...Thanks!

[Jake777]

Well....no luck I raised the machine base vol to 10 and lowered the LCD vol to 13, it did not make any change. I did get the donk donk when the max bet button was pushed a few more times than I have heard in the past but not consistantly (maybe only 4 time in 20 min of play).
I checked the MPU board and didn't see any simm sticks, checked all connections on the inside of the LCD box. You mentioned that most of the sounds most likely are generated from the flash card in the top box, do you think that the problem might be with the card or a currupt card. Can I get another card with the sound information. I did take both cards out and re-seated them, no luck.

[stayouttadabunker]

Holy crap your machine must be loud!
I usually only put my base volume at around 2 or 3 and the LCD volume at around 4 or 5.
I didn't know the LCD volume can go as high as "13" ? Is that a keyboard mistake?

Anyways, I cannot explain why your Max bet "donk, donk" sound intermittently works.
I do NOT think your CF flash card is corrupt at all.
Once the sound byte is programmed into it - it should play it.
I think there's something else wrong but I'm not sure what it could be.
There's some sort of missing communication link from the point of when you hit the Max bet button until the sound byte is played.
I don't know if it's a microprocessor problem or some other MPU IC board component
or something going intermittently bad on the topbox computer board?

Someone with a better first-hand knowledge of schematics reading, may be able to pinpoint the IC component, than I.
Personally, I would try swapping out parts to see if I could locate a particular bad board.
The other thing I can think of is a possible dirty, oxidized pin on the topbox computer's slot where the flash card is inserted.
That could possibly give out intermittent sounds too.
However, you've already re-inserted that PCMCIA card and
that act alone should have helped take off some oxidization from a bad pin - at least to get some better contact.

Another thing to try, is to take out the SB chip
and carefully re-insert it back into the socket on the machine's MPU board socket.
I believe the SB chip has the "triggering" command for the topbox PCMCIA's "donk, donk" sound.

In other words, the "Max" bet sounds are stored in the flash card,
and the sound commands are stored in the SB chip.
The trigger to set off the sound byte comes from the SB chip - when you push the "Max" bet button.
I looks for the sound byte on the flash card
and tells the topbox's MPU processor to play it.

Basically, if there's any problem in communication anywhere (harnesses, board traces, IC board components, eprom pin legs, etc.) between the top and bottom of your machine - you get little problems like this.
It's definitely a PITA to locate too I'm afraid.
That's why it's always good to either have another machine to swap parts
or just have a bunch of spare parts on-hand to swap.

[Jake777]

Bunker , I went back and re-read all the posts and tried all the suggestions  and checked all the connections a second time just too make sure I hadn’t missed anything. I did set the machine base volume to 10, but the sound level did not raise, the reel sounds and bonus sounds stayed the same level until I raised the LCD volume to 4 not 14 which I read wrong off the screen.. The play one credit button sound did not raise when adjusted by machine base but did with LCD volume. Still no sound on the max bet button or credits when a win is registered from the reels.

I was reading one of your past posts back in January of this year , helping jdkmunch with a sound problem on his S2000, in which you had made some videos on adjusting the sound. I applied some of those learning and from some of your suggestions here is what I think might be the problem. The machine base sound is not present at all and I think the sounds are coming from the top box like you mentioned in your videos to jdkmunch. I took the SB chip out (I couldn’t find my extractor, had to purchase a new one which caused the delay in this post),  cleaned the pins lightly and this did not help. I turned the machine base volume off and I have all the sounds that I started with and none of the sounds that I am trying to get. This leads me to believe your statement that the SB chip is not sending the signal from the MPU to the top box to produce the sounds from the cf card when called for. I think this will be a good place to start in swapping out parts.

My SB chip is Stepper Base SB000283, is this a common chip and can I purchase another one from one of the member vendors? If so and anyone following this thread that would like to sell one send me a PM, I’m interested. I also want to personally say thanks, Bunker and Foster for staying with me on this problem. I got this machine as a project machine and I guess it is living up to its intent. I will post back with results as I proceed, but next week I get to go to the Mother Land (Vegas) for the week and won’t be working on the machine until I return.

[stayouttadabunker]

Bingo! As you stated, when you turned up the LCD volume, the sound increased for the Play One Credit button!
It's a start as to where to troubleshoot!

It seems like the button sound volumes for your game is controlled mostly via the topbox LCD unit.
I've also noticed that phenomenon too in which sometimes it seemed like my volume did not increased -
even when increasing the LCD volume.
I was sure it had something to do with the speakers resistors I had installed
on my white speaker wires in attempt to reduce the hum and hiss feedback noises.
I had reduced these two topbox speaker resistors from 47 Ohms to 10 Ohms of resistance
and that allowed me to have a louder machine without the background feedback noises too, too prevalent.
My goal was to get the best sounds that I could possibly get without spending
the big bucks for a 504B revision MPU board which addressed those noise problems.

There are numerous jumpers on the sound amplifier board as well that I fooled around with
and seemed to get slightly different levels of sound as well but never documented exactly what I had done.
All that I can remember offhand is that I fooled around with the amplifier jumpers until I got the best sound I could hear.
Your machine may or may not have an amplifier board installed at all
and may rely totally on the output from the topbox LCD unit.

I don't believe that any of your chips or flash cards are corrupt at all.
I did think that there may be more of a physical problem with some sort
of extra resistance on a pin somewhere - due to oxidization build-up.
This is the only reason now that I can think of that would give you intermittent "donk, donk" sounds.

This is a parallel example of why I believe this...>>>

On an S+, the main 6-pin Molex power connector from the power supply
to the motherboard is notoriously known for burning up on the 3rd ground receptor pin.
This is due to the oxidization of the male pin.
It starts a change reaction and over time, the receptor pin just does NOT grasp the male pin so well.
In fact, it gets so bad that it's starts to electrically arc voltage between the male pin and the female receptor pin
resulting in browning of the plastic Molex housing.
This connector point progressively worsens and diminishes to being useless
due to the arcing heat produced inside of the Molex housing.
At some point, the connection fails so bad that the machine cannot function properly.

That's a good time to clean up the male pins
and change out the receptor pin if possible, or the whole power harness.
An NLG member swears by the use of a product called "De-Oxit" available at Radio Shack
but I've never picked up a can of it to try...
I use some other contact cleaner called "CRC QD Electronic Cleaner" quick-drying formula spray can.
I have no clue where I got from...lol
These are good electronic contact cleaning products and is good to use before any contacts have begun to fail as a periodic maintenance.

I believe some where up in the topbox of your machine, there is a bad pin connection - but where?
Also, could it be a failing IC component on the LCD board that is related to the sound signals?
I don't know...

[brianfink]

I have had several vision machines have there sound go out and it almost always is a problem with the mpu If you can put sg 363 and a dsv 42 in the board that may solve the problem but otherwise I would suggest trying a different board.

[Jake777]

Hi Brian

Thanks for the tip, I have completly tore the top box apart and checked and cleaned the connectors with  CRC cleaner, Checked and cleaned everything down below too. Your suggestions might be ture. Let me tell some more to the story. At the start of this thread I didn't think this was relevent. When I contacted the seller of this machine he said that when he moved the machine from his basement  that it did not work and someone told him it was a bad power supply, thats why he was selling it. When I called he again he said that a guy came over and looked at the machine. They disconnected the ballast going to the florecents above the reels and the machine worked again except for that florecent. Thats were I got the machine I replaced the balast. When I fired the machine up the tube came on but I seen an arc near the door. I turned it off quickly and found that one of the wires to the bulb recepticale had come loose and shorted on the door frame when the door was moved. I repaired that and can't really remember if it had the sounds before or not, I think not. Could something like that cause this.
I don't have sb 363 of dsv42 to change out, I would have to purchase them. One a scale of 1-10, will they help orshould I go after replacing the MPU. Working with Bunker and Foster suggestions I think I am now down to replacing components, so where mightbe the best place to start.
Thanks again for the reply, I will keep everyone posted.

[brianfink]

If it was me I would get a new/used MPU it never herts to have a spare

[Jake777]

Update
  I got a newer tested good board, I placed all the chips on it and it didn't change a thing. If I replace the sg chips with 363's will they be compatible with my sb chip, I tried the sg 598's that came with the new board and they gave me a system error Will a dvs 42 add sounds and does it plug into the MPU, I got to think that the machine is capable of at least the max bet sounds, could it be that the machine is set up, not saying wrong but maybe coin to credit or  credit to coin. I think I read something about that, I've read some much it all blurry now. Well that's were I'm at at this point.
Thanks Everone

[stayouttadabunker]

I would like you to open up the attachment I've submitted below.
It is a page from the SG000598 PSR sheet.
It deals primarily with your sound options for your SG000598 (GME1&2) chip pairs.
You need to get into the menus again
and try to set your 3.2.5 "Roll Up sounds to "enhanced" to get the machine to play a melodic sounds will counting up the credits.
You may need to enlarge the page I've attached to see it better.
I believe all you need to do is click on it?...>>>

[Jake777]

Bunker
Here's what I did, when I got the newer board I placed all the chips from my old board on the newer one which are the sb000283 and sg000123, working Thur the call attendant, ram error and eprom errors the machine boots up and acts just like it did with the old board. I accessed the menus and for sound I only get two options machine base vol and mech bell, their are not sub items I can select.

I then placed the sg000598's in and here is what I get
Call Attendant (top candle flashing slow)
Open door "System Error" on display (top and bottom candle flashing
Key once "Game types not linked -0x305
Key again "Critical data will be lost"
Key again "Press test button 2-3 sec"
Close door
Initializing
Test memory
Call Attendant
System Error

I can't get passed this to see if I have any option in the sound settings

If I put the sg000123's back in I start back where I started this post, Think the 598's are compatible with the sb00283

[stayouttadabunker]

If I put the sg000123's back in I start back where I started this post, Think the 598's are compatible with the sb00283

I'm not so sure about that because you're getting the "Game Types Not Linked -0x305" message.
That would mean that the SG00598's are NOT a match for your SB000283 game?
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong on this...thanks.

I would stick with the SG000123's, since they came with the game originally.
I doubt that there's any problems with your chips.

The sheet I attached above has to do with your main cabinet machine volume settings - not with the LCD topbox computer setup.
A vision machine is somewhat more complicated than a regular S2000 machine because a Vision machine has an extra computer in the topbox.

You need to get to the 3.2.1 sound volume set up menus while viewing the blue VFD display screen on the reel glass for the cabinet menus in order to utilize the sheet I attached above -
specifically, the 3.2.5 menu option for roll-up sounds
and set it to "enhanced".

[brianfink]

try unpluging the audio cable from the back of the display and pluging it directly into one of your speakers it uses the same molex connector that should tell you for shure if the problem is with the machine or the amp inside the display

[Jake777]

Brian and Bunker

   Made some ground today. Kudo's to Brian I followed his instructions, plugged the audio from the top box into the left speaker. Played the machine and got the max bet sound,credit win from the reels, the reel spin was the generic spin sound in the left while the enhanced was coming from the right. I unplugged the right and lost all the bonus game sounds and enhanced reel spin sounds. Guess that leads us to the machine is capable of producing the sounds something in the top box is preventing them. Brian mentioned an Amp, are they difficult to replace or are we looking at replacing the top box. I'll contact some of our member dealers and get an idea then it's decision time.
Thanks again everyone, making some progress, a little more information at a time

[Jake777]

Another Question
I just contacted Blueridge slots and they say that they have a Amp for the top box, the only thing is he mentioned that it goes outside and not in the top box itself. Is this the the Amp I need or will it work in conjunction with the top box, or do I need to replace the top box board which has the Amp on it. Any help and I will proceed.

[stayouttadabunker]

You might need the harness that goes from the top box LCD computer display to the amplifier?
Make sure you let Blueridge know that it was a Vision machine setup that you have.

[brianfink]

I have a couple of older lcd's that I use for parts I will try to take a look and see if there is a seperate amp It's been awile since I have messed with one of those I am not to shure if the external amp will work with the lcd If it is what I think it is it is made to amplify and split the sound into 2.1 stereo with a 3rd base speaker you probly dont even have and if you did go with that you would definatly need a wireing harness from the backplane to the amp

[brianfink]

I took a look at the old lcd's I have today and it looks like the audio for the machine plugs directly into the main board of the display it is possible that the plug came loose inside of your display you might want to check that out. Also there is a place where it looks like an enhanced sound board might go. The plugs are identical to the plugs on a 502 board and I know that sometimes adding an enhanced sound board to a 502 board can restore game sounds but I am not really sure what should go there if anything. I do also have some amps made by bally systems that take the game sounds from a regular s2000 coming directly from the amp and mixes them pasivly with an amped aux audio sorce you could use to mix the audio from the machine and the audio coming from the display threw both of your speakers but it would take some cutting and spliceing to do so.     

[brianfink]

here are some picks of the amp I was refering to

[Jake777]

HI
  A quick update, had to wait for parts. I thought I had this nailed by reading other post and coming to the conclusion that the top LCD has it's own amp and that the machine is sending the sound signals to the top box, believing that the problem was in the top box. Well I replaced the top LCD, and quess what, lm back to square one I still have no sound for credit rollup, max bet or credit rollup from BV. The machine plays the same way when I started, So It's mot the MPU or LCD.  I'll post some more questions when I get home about adding a sound simm.

[cowboygames]

The top box lcd is wired to, through the audio output of that unit, and sends sound down to the MPU which in turn is wired to and sends it back up to the amp and out to the speakers. This config I beleive will allow you to mix top box sounds with MPU embedded sounds to get what you're looking for

[Jake777]

I think I understand thoses comments, when I plug the two wire audio input from the mpu into a speaker I get the sounds I need but I also get the enhanced reel spin sounds with the generis reel spin sounds. One from one speaker and the other from the other side. If I could turn the generic reel spin soud off I might get what Im looking for. Going back to my first post I don't have a section in the menu for reel sound, just base machine and bell, any ideas

[cowboygames]

You're getting a combination of generic and LCD enhanced sounds. Without installing a multimedia board and sound simm on the MPU you will have limited options. I don't remember what you can turn off in the MPU menus to eliminate your crossover problem, sorry. Would you help us out by describing how your sound is routed from the LCD to the MPU to the amp board? Please include which sockets on the motherboard things are plugged into and out of