RNG question on an s2000

[DannyG804]

When changing game kits - glass, strips and SB chip only - does the RNG get reset after clearing errors? Or does it only reset with a key/clear? Probably an easy answer for most...

Danny

[Foster]

Not 100% sure but I would say only resets on a clear
Game change I doubt but it is still possible

[a69mopar]

The RNG (random Number Generator) "resets" after each play.  I would love to see some evidence to prove me wrong on this.  Each play of the game has the same odds, it just matters when you press the button.  This is what they tell us anyway.  

Thanks,
Wayne

[Foster]

That is not a reset, the RNG is initially seeded some how then uses its output to start the next run of the RNG code
That is just the way computer programmers think

Tthe RNG code could be written for recursion. 
Which means that the code can call itself to add to the randomness

The one thing that affects the RNG output used is how often the player places or can place a wager (every win delays the player)

[knagl]

Keep in mind that the Random Number Generator does just that -- it generates random numbers.  It does not itself determine wins and losses, but rather generates a number which corresponds to reel stops on the reels.  Then, if the numbers generated result in a winning combination of reel stops, the player is paid.  Changing game kits doesn't make a machine any more likely or less likely to pay out (unless one of the games is more or less generous to the player).

[staz]

when does the RNG generate numbers when the player inserts the money in a machine or when the player pushes the spin button..... also would the same numbers come up with 1 credit verses 2 credits on a machine.....  for example on a $5 wheel of fortune i cant tell ya how many times your left with one credit and you hit it and the spin symbol falls and you dont get the spin cuz you only had one credit.... if you added $5 to your one credit would of you still gotten the spin? i always wondered about that....also is there a seperate rng for the bonus spin on a wheel of fortune or does the machine already no what amount the wheel will land on when the spin symbol hits the payline???

[Foster]

The RNG pretty much runs all the time (there are times that it may not run while machine is on but who knows when that is)
I am thinking that error or a tilt might stop it running

The critical thing is that the RNG output is only used once a wager (bet) is placed

think of a bingo or lotto drawing machine with numbered balls
the balls are being tumbled the whole time the machin is on and the balls are allowed to become output once a door or gate is opened
Just we never know the actual number that was used to create the outcome we see on the reels and virtual stops are related to the number but we do not know the math used to come up with the virtual stops.

[a69mopar]

That is not a reset, the RNG is initially seeded some how then uses its output to start the next run of the RNG code
That is just the way computer programmers think

The RNG code could be written for recursion. 
Which means that the code can call itself to add to the randomness

The one thing that affects the RNG output used is how often the player places or can place a wager (every win delays the player)

  yes, reset is not the correct word to use.  In it's literal sense, it implies that it had changed from it's original state, which it didn't.  I should have said that the RNG never resets, or is never affected by a reset. they are not seeded. Your bingo ball analogy is likely better, but remember, the bingo balls never leave the drum and continuously move/change, only a snap shot is taken when a number is called for.  Each play is independent and is not affected by any other play.  I expect this thread to get into virtual reel stops...

W

[staz]

so the rng never stops or does it stop when the machine is on idle with no credits in it? also say you get off a machine and someone sits on it and hits a jackpot would of you hit that if you continued to play the machine? And heres the big ?? can the casino controll the jackpot hits on there high limit machines?? i seen after a 80k hit on a $100 machine they put every machine like 20 of them in the high limit room out of service with a push of a button....how can you shut a room of machines down without putting each one manually out of service? 
 

[cowboygames]

It's probably safe to say the RNG is activated when you push the spin button and grabs a set of numbers within a miniscule set amount of time. It probably takes less than a second for the RNG to roll through all the possible stop combinations and pick one for each reel, completely at random. It wouldn't actually have to run before you push the button because the speeds it works at are so fast. As far as the jackpot question, even the person that got it wouldn't have if they'd of hit the button a fraction of a second later. The casino can't control when jackpots hit or change payback percents at random and I would guess they are shutting the machines down or putting them in standby with a command from the computer mainframe. They don't have to physically go to the machine, they can do it through the SAS

[dpalmi]

Check out the article "Taking the Mystery Out of the Machine: A Guide to Understanding Slot Machines" on this webpage, it talks about a lot of the questions you are asking.

http://www.americangaming.org/social-responsibility/responsible-gaming/understanding-games

Dan #2

[DannyG804]

Keep in mind that the Random Number Generator does just that -- it generates random numbers.  It does not itself determine wins and losses, but rather generates a number which corresponds to reel stops on the reels.  Then, if the numbers generated result in a winning combination of reel stops, the player is paid.  Changing game kits doesn't make a machine any more likely or less likely to pay out (unless one of the games is more or less generous to the player).

All great and interesting replies here. This one appears to answer my question... I've switched out dozens and dozens of kits in 3 s2000's in the past 3 years. The one thing I can say for sure is that the winnings have all been random. The theme being played doesnt matter at all except for the volatility of some games which have high jackpots. They have lower hit frequencies.

I had read a few times before that the RNG is based of 10 million pulls equaling one cycle.  That's what made me initially start this thread.

[Foster]

According to IGT and others the RNG is generating numbers the whole time the machine is ready to play,
If I remember right it on the shows I seen about slots someone stated the regulations concerning Electronic Gaming Machines (slots, etc) requires the RNG to generate numbers while idle ready to play and must grab the number available for as soon as the bet is placed.
and from what IGT spokesmen on a show stated the number generated is a large number and they do some simple math to pull out the reel stops
like programmers would do to convert from decimal to hex with pen and paper but the base would the number of virtual stops


Now concerning what the RNG is doing during the current game being played, tilts, errors, or wins who knows.
The S2000 could keep it running 100% of the time the machine is on after it finishes the boot sequence.