stats

[wla357]

for all you fellow stat freaks out there who know way more than me i wonder if you could enlighten me on a few things.

i've got several games on an s2k platform and counting the stops i can map out all the payout combinations and probability of hitting each on a particular spin. on my sizzling 7's, for instance, there are 4 stops per reel for the sizzling 7 symbol out of 64 virtual stops, yielding 4/64 x 4/64 x 4/64 or 1/4096 odds of hitting the top jackpot, which pays out 1000 credits. so then i project that for 10,000 spins the machine will, on average, hit the jackpot 2.441 times yielding a payback of 2441 credits for every 30,000 credits played (10,000 spins). by mapping out this machines stops and calculating the odds of each payout i should theoretically be able to arrive at the 98% payback the machine is programmed for, right? but my calculations only come up to about 97%.

and how does the machine change the odds? when i set the game for 98% or 85% the virtual stops are identical - so i can't see how the odds are changing if the virtual stops all remain the same.

when i go into period terminal accounting for this game the machine reports 92.34% payback and 7.66% hold on 43380 games played. pta1 = $372,095 and pta2 = $343,622 so the percentage it's calculating appears to be correct. is 40k-50k games played an insufficient number to get the 98% the machine is set for? if so, how many games does it take?

i'm stumped.  

[Ron (r273)]

There is only one long time resident here that may be able to answer that. lol

That would be Statfreak,....... where are you! 

Ron (r273)

[cowboygames]

I think smaller payback percents eliminate the frequency of hits for smaller wins to adjust and payback percent is based on the life of the game which I believe is calculated at 40 million spins or some god awful huge number like that

[wla357]

There is only one long time resident here that may be able to answer that. lol

That would be Statfreak,....... where are you! 

Ron (r273)

there's actually someone named stat freak? lol yeah, that's who would probably know!

[wla357]

I think smaller payback percents eliminate the frequency of hits for smaller wins to adjust and payback percent is based on the life of the game which I believe is calculated at 40 million spins or some god awful huge number like that

that would make sense on the smaller paybacks, but i'd expect to see the virtual stops changed when i change the percentage - but they were identical which was confusing me.

40 million spins! wow - so my 40k spin test is off by a few orders of magnitude! lol

[cowboygames]

Little bit, life of the machine is a long time. First S2000 I had was 3yrs old when I got it. It was a quarter machine, but had already had 6 million dollars run through it according to the accounting figures

[daddy2yea]

RNG

[knagl]

The virtual stops do not remain the same between the different payback percentage programs. The number of virtual symbols are changed to get the different paybacks. Generally speaking, the number of top award symbols will remain the same between programs, but some of the mid-level symbols will be tweaked to get the desired percentage.

[wla357]

RNG

The virtual stops do not remain the same between the different payback percentage programs. The number of virtual symbols are changed to get the different paybacks. Generally speaking, the number of top award symbols will remain the same between programs, but some of the mid-level symbols will be tweaked to get the desired percentage.

i figured it was something like that but when i mapped a game out at different percentages i didn't find any difference in the stops. i must have counted wrong. thanks for the reply.

[cowboygames]

If I understand this correctly from previous discussion in other topics, they assign actual stops multiple different numbers. The same blank space reel stop may have 3, 4 or whatever numbers assigned to it and they changed those number assignments to get higher or lower payback percents and increase or decrease the total number of potential RNG number choices. Though the Jackpot symbols I'm sure only have one assigned number each. So if a reel strip only has say 26 actual stops on the strip, by assigning some stops more numbers they may actually get 40+ virtual stops per strip as far as the RNG chip is concerned.

[knagl]

i figured it was something like that but when i mapped a game out at different percentages i didn't find any difference in the stops. i must have counted wrong. thanks for the reply.

If you have the PAR sheet for your game, it should show you the reel stops/number of symbols per reel.

[wla357]

i figured it was something like that but when i mapped a game out at different percentages i didn't find any difference in the stops. i must have counted wrong. thanks for the reply.

If you have the PAR sheet for your game, it should show you the reel stops/number of symbols per reel.

i just mapped a different game (72 stop, triple bonanza @ 95% & 92.51%) using the reel strip test and sure enough one blank on one reel was switched with a 3 bar and a one bar and a blank were switched on a different reel. cool learning this stuff. thanks for the help!