Is it safe to use a UPS on an S+?

[jdkmunch]

I'm going to test it. 

You guys are right - I think I remember looking at that graph when apc was installing the system. 

[5 ACES]

Used my Dad's meter and it reads 120 Volts. Would it be safe to say that the UPS that reads 100 Volts is messed up somehow? Just asking before I chuck it in the trash. 

Appreciate (learn) how meters work.  Does his meter measure RMS?  RMS is a concept also learned in high school calculus.  Does the meter measure RMS or voltage of only the lower frequency components or voltage peaks?   Each may produce a same number OR different numbers depending on the AC voltage waveform.

  Meanwhile, that 200 volt square wave (output by a typicaly UPS when in battery backup mode) might also (accurately) measure 120 Volts on an RMS meter.

westom, you are correct! Just received an E-Mail from APC on True RMS meter and a Non-True RMS meter and here's a short part of that e-mail:                                                                                 

Note: This discussion is a result of the fact that a Non-True RMS meter will

read anywhere from 80 - 90 Vac from the output of a 120 Vac APC UPS (or 170 -

180 Vac from the output of a 230 Vac APC UPS) producing a stepped approximated

sine wave while operating on-battery. This is not an issue when the UPS is

operating on-line.

So basically my understanding is that, reading my UPS with a regular meter shows 80- 90 volts while on battery power, which it does. So my UPS isn't messed up is it?

[westom]

So basically my understanding is that, reading my UPS with a regular meter shows 80- 90 volts while on battery power, which it does. So my UPS isn't messed up is it?

To answer your question, this previouisly posted question must be answered.
> Does the meter measure RMS or voltage of only the lower frequency components or voltage peaks?
IOW is it an RMS multimeter?

[5 ACES]

So basically my understanding is that, reading my UPS with a regular meter shows 80- 90 volts while on battery power, which it does. So my UPS isn't messed up is it?

To answer your question, this previouisly posted question must be answered.
> Does the meter measure RMS or voltage of only the lower frequency components or voltage peaks?
IOW is it an RMS multimeter?

No it is not. It is a Simpson 260-8P, which is not a RMS multimeter.

[Thor777]

I see we have become quite involve in this topic here...  I am just wondering as to WHY you would need a UPS on a slot machine?    

  A surge protector I understand but UPS... 

[stayouttadabunker]

That way he can play while the power is out...

Didn't the "baby boomer" generation start because of numerous power shortages?

[Thor777]

That way he can play while the power is out...

Didn't the "baby boomer" generation start because of numerous power shortages?

   But, But, I thought Slots only mutliply in the DARK! 

[stayouttadabunker]

Oh yeah! You're right!.... (Mark smacking himself in the head)

[5 ACES]

That way he can play while the power is out...

Didn't the "baby boomer" generation start because of numerous power shortages?

   But, But, I thought Slots only mutliply in the DARK! 

  Good one Thor777!! I know, I do feel a little guilty about discussing this on NLG and it has drifted off the subject. It's just that where I live, surge protectors don't offer protection from brownouts. For shi*'s and giggles, I hooked up a UPS to my S+ and actually, we had a power failure about three hours ago for 15 minutes. Sure was cool to still play the machine! It's just that I had the wrong impression of what my UPS was doing. I thought it was putting out 90 volts, but westom pointed out that I needed a meter that reads RMS. As of this very moment, I now understand what happened, the UPS is hooked to my S+, pumping out enough volts to keep it running and life is good! My apologies for shooting off the topic. But hey, now we know everything about UPS's and that slots can mutliply in the LIGHT!

[Thor777]

My apologies for shooting off the topic. But hey, now we know everything about UPS's and that slots can mutliply in the LIGHT!

   We ALL seem to eventually shoot off the topic of most threads, I can be pretty bad about hijacking a thread but I usually don't try to do It untill most of the "topic" discussion is addressed..    

  Kinda like this one, you guys were "so involved" I didn't dare jump in   

[jay]

So it begs the question.... are the casinos on UPS ?

It would seem to me that given the power draw they would probably would have a generator backup their power and only use the UPS for bridging.... but it would have to be one hell of a generator to supply the entire casino floor and lighting.....

[5 ACES]

So it begs the question.... are the casinos on UPS ?

It would seem to me that given the power draw they would probably would have a generator backup their power and only use the UPS for bridging.... but it would have to be one hell of a generator to supply the entire casino floor and lighting.....

I know of a casino around these parts that had 20-30 slot machines on some kind of battery backup/generator, when a bad snow storm hit and caused a blackout. The casino was small in size, I think they had around 200-300 machines, but they did have a few that were still playable during the power outage. It's actually what sparked me to do the same, but my tiny little casino only has 1 machine! 

[westom]

So it begs the question.... are the casinos on UPS ?

Generators take time to get up to speed.  Facilities that need uninterrupted power must have some power source for about 30 seconds; while the generator starts.

  Some casino machines use electric motors.  Therefore output from a typical plug-in UPS can be harmful.  Casinos would also use more expensive technology UPSes that actually output sine waves.  How much for a household 'since wave' generating UPS?  The $100 UPS must be replaced by a $500 UPS.

  When selling a UPS to the naive, these manufacturers invent subjective phrases that mean nothing (often to promote myths and half truths) such as modified sine wave, simulated sine wave, etc.  Expressions that mean nothing because numbers are not included.  If that UPS manufacturer is being honest, provided are numbers such as THD.   To promote a scam, a manufacture must have customers not demand numbers.  You see it here.  So many discussing a UPS in subjective terms.  Not quoting numbers from numeric specs.  Assuming subjective terms have meaning.   Worse, no one got angry because the manufacturer did not provide numbers.  Exposed is the subjective ‘modified sine wave’ myth that is created to intentionally deceive.   No one got angry once the purpose of that subjective term was exposed.

  A modified sine wave.  What should be a 120 volt sine wave is a 200 volt square wave. If the square wave is properly manipulated (as brichter discussed), then the RMS volt meter will measure that 200 volt square wave as 120 volts.   In that example, the modified sine wave also had a spike of up to 270 volts between the square waves.  Where is ‘clean’ electricity from a ‘modified sine wave’?  The myth promoted only because consumers did not demand numbers.  Because consumers gave credence to a subjective term using only feelings.

  Same UPS that may be ideal to computers (because computers are so robust) can be destructive to refrigerators.  If numbers are not provided to expose that reality, then integrity of that UPS manufacturer should be questioned.  This discussion without numbers would proobably prmote a scam.