PE Plus Poker problems

[Kid Smack]

My buddy has a PE+ poker machine with a "few" problems. Originally, about every couple of weeks the knife on the hopper would loosen and a quarter would jam it up. All he ever had to do was pull it out, refill, close the door and it would spit them out and clear. The last time it happened, it didn't clear. I went over to take a look at it and after trying the reset and test button I could only guess that the machine didn't think the door was closed. He bought both door optics off Ebay, and after putting them in there was still no response. The screen said "coin in time out." Just yesterday I found and downloaded the manual on here, (thanks to the uploader.) This would lead me to believe it's a coin in the comparitor or a bill stuck in the head. Checked everything, found nothing. He pulled the optic off the hopper and it was full of hair and fuzz, etc., we put it back in and still nothing. Now clueless, (and my mistake)...I have an old Sigma machine that was somewhat modded and missing some switches and at a last resort when the machine became unresponsive I could pull a chip off the board, reinsert and everything would be cleared and it would work fine...So I pulled the game chip on his and when I put it back in everything was still the same. So I pulled the RAM chip and of course broke a leg off in the process. Now the screen says door open, CMOS data. Pic below. Also a pic of the board. Sooo, 1st off, after looking for the same RAM chip, I see they're hard to come by. The chip # is MCM60L256APC10, Motorola I believe. Is there a different chip I could use for replacement? Do I need a clear chip like I see in a number of other posts on here? Is there a good place to get one? I think the Ebay optics he got were bad as a wire on the receiver literally fell off untouched after closing the door the second time. Any ideas?

[Kid Smack]

Sorry, the board pic didn't post. Trying again.

[Buzz]

I keep a old chip laying around just for a leg Donor . solder a new leg onto the old chip.

[knagl]

Welcome to  , Kid Smack.

There are a few different issues at work here -- you crammed a lot of information into your post (but that's good!).

First, you obviously should get the RAM chip issue resolved.  Is there enough of the broken leg remaining attached to the chip that you can re-solder a new leg on as Buzz suggested?  I'll check with a friend who has a lot of spare parts to see if he might have one of those chips, but I can't make any promises.

Second, was the error "Coin-IN Timeout" or "Coin-OUT Timeout"?  You mentioned that there was a ton of hair and fuzz blocking the hopper optic, which could cause a coin-out issue (not in, though).  You will not get a coin-in timeout error on a dollar bill issue in the validator, so that can be eliminated.  A coin-in timeout is due to the coin-in optics being blocked for too long, or if they're disconnected you'll also get that error.  I can't tell from that picture, but if that's a slant top or a bartop drop-in model and you remove the coin-in assembly (which has to be done to remove the hopper), you'll get that coin-in timeout error if the machine has power and the assembly is removed.

As far as checking if the optics are working, there are a few ways to do it.  The easiest is to open and close the door while that CMOS Data error is on the screen.  See the "Door Open" message on the screen (in your picture)?  That should go away when the door is closed.  If it's a slant or a bartop, make sure the lower door is closed and latched, too, as well as the bill validator door.  Another way to check the optics in your current state is to use a digital camera or camcorder and look at the optic through the screen on the camera -- you should see a solid or flickering white/blue light coming from the emitter optic when the machine has power.  Only one half of the optic pair will light up -- the other side (the receiver) will not light up.

As far as clearing the CMOS Data error, that's generally a snap, and no clear chip is required.  Press and HOLD the white "Self Test" button for about five seconds.  If the speaker is working you should hear a small "ding".  Close the door (again, the "door open" message should and needs to go away), turn the jackpot reset key, and you will either be good to go or get another error (EEPROM something or other).  If that happens, open the door again, press and release the self test button, and close the door -- you should be in business.

For your future reference, you should never need to remove that RAM chip (which should be a little piece of good news since you'll have a delicate soldered leg in there).


If you're still having door issues, reply back here and let us know.  You'll have to get the door closed (as far as the machine is concerned) for part of the process to get past the CMOS Data error.

[Kid Smack]

Thanks for all the info knagl.

The machine is an IGT slant top. It definitely said coin in timeout when I went to look at it. I don't know if that's what it said when he cleared the hopper jam. My guess is that the coin in timeout came up after he pulled the comparitor to get the hopper out. I did try holding the test switch and turning the reset key after I messed up the chip and came up with the screen pictured above, but I can't say I did it exactly as I found directed in another post or in the manual (since I didn't want to print out 256 pages.) I didn't get the ping after holding the switch down, but I'll have to go back and try it again.

As far as the RAM goes, I haven't done soldering before but could probably at least give it a try. I did find the spec sheet for the original chip, which can be viewed here: http://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/view/4507/MOTOROLA/MCM60L256AFC10.html
After doing some searching, I came up with this: http://www.newark.com/cypress-semiconductor/cy7c199cn-15pxc/sram-ic/dp/19M3763 Would this be a suitable replacement? I'm guessing that seeing it is just a memory chip there really isn't any information on the chip needed for gameplay other than past game info and error info. Not knowing alot about these things, feel free to correct me.

On the door optics, I did try the camera trick on the old one emitter and didn't see anything you described. I'll have to try it on the new one (used one he bought) as I didn't have a camera on me at the time. I'll have to try that again. First thing is to fix the chip, agreed. Let me know if you think that would replace it.

Thanks for the help.

[knagl]

If he pulled the comparator assembly then that's very likely the cause of the coin-in timeout.  Let's set that aside for now.

As far as the chip, I'd agree that it probably only holds some current game data and doesn't need anything specific programmed into it.  However, I don't know what chip might be a suitable replacement.  Stolistic here on the forum would be able to confirm or deny what we're thinking the chip does as he knows the board inside and out, and also likely would know what chip could be used there.  I should see my friend on Saturday who may have the chip -- perhaps I'll be able to get you an exact replacement.

Let's start with the chip first, then get the rest of the game up and running.

[Kid Smack]

Ok, thanks. Does Stolistic frequent the site or is there a way to contact him?

[knagl]

Yes and yes.  You can send him a PM if you'd like, though.

[Buzz]

I have a PE+ board here in my hand and I can't find a chip with the number you gave. So my question is what location did you remove the chip? Maybe my board has  a replacement chip in it.

[Kid Smack]

Buzz, if you look at the picture of the board above, it's the larger chip right in the middle just to the left of the chip that's glared out from the flash.
It says RAM just above it. What's the number on your chip in that position?

[Stolistic]

Buzz, it's in U65.

You have to get the chip from a superboard so it is 32K x 8 bit SRAM, if you have a non-superboard you will probably only have a 8K x 8 bit SRAM in it.

Kid Smack:  The link you showed to the replacement chip does appear to match specifications.  If shipping is cheap, I would give it a shot, unless Buzz or someone else has a spare for you.  I have a few SRAMs from a non-superboard, so they are no use to you.

[Buzz]

Jim I think it's a super board Part # on board  75703407 the number on U65 chip is HY6264LP- 10  Hyunda 9005C   I did check two other boards and they both had  MS62256L-10    I can pull
  out 6 or 8 more and check them if needed.

If the small part of the leg is broken off,  it's no big deal to solder another one back on. I break a leg off a old chip as high up as possible ( The fat part ) a little dab of solder on it place it over the fat part of the chip you are repairing and touch with a soldering iron. Good as new.  I do like to use soldering flux.

DO we know if this is a Super board in question?

[Kid Smack]

I'm fairly certain it's a superboard from what I've seen on other posts. The game chip says PE Plus Game. It has 4 or 5 (not sure off hand) different games on it.

I don't think I have any chips laying around and while soldering it sounds easy enough, I don't have a solder gun. I checked the data sheet for the original chip and after checking data sheets on numerous other chips, I found one in which all 28 pins and their uses (address inputs, data in/out, etc.) match the original 100%. It can be found here: http://www.newark.com/integrated-device-technology/idt71256sa20yg/sram-memory-ic/dp/34M6449?Ntt=34M6449 Appently it can be bought in different sizes (300 mil, 600mil, etc.) and it doesn't give me the option to select, but the best I can tell, it should be the right one. So for just over 2 bucks I ordered it. I needed some heat sinks for my Sigma machine which seems to be overheating anyhow. USPS priority mail shouldn't be too much for a chip and a couple of clip-ons. (I'll be posting more questions on that another day in the Sigma section.)

Anyhow, thanks for all your help everyone. I'll post an update in a few days or so when I get the chip put in and then I can follow up on the other problems from my original post.
Thanks much.

[knagl]

DO we know if this is a Super board in question?

I'm fairly certain it's a superboard from what I've seen on other posts.

Only the superboard has a program AND data socket, so yes, it's a superboard.  Also, only the superboard can run the multi-poker game sets, which based on the label on the chips (and what you stated) is what your friend has.  He's got one of the good multi-poker sets, too, with full-pay Jacks or Better and Bonus Poker on there.

Let us know once you get the replacement chip and we'll go from there.  If you think the optics are bad, you may wish to post a "WTB" ("want to buy") message in the classifieds section of the forum for a set of PE+ slant top optics.  They shouldn't be too expensive, and it'd be helpful to have for troubleshooting your door issue.  (Did we ever establish if the "Door Open" message goes away when you close the door?  If so, then the optics are fine.)

[Kid Smack]

At the moment, the screen is still the same as above, "Door Open, Call Attendent, CMOS Data." I went back today to try holding the test button and wait for the ding but nothing happened. Incidently, is it possible to clear the "Door Open" problem in the state the machine is currently in? Today I made the bypass cable shown in another post (ala stayouttadabunker) and it had no effect on the machine.

[knagl]

Yes, even on the CMOS Data error screen, the "Door Open" message should appear if a door is open, and disappear when all the doors are closed (it won't say "closure" or anything -- it just won't say "Door Open" on the screen).  As mentioned before, make sure that the belly door is closed and latched, and that the bill validator door is completely closed with the cash can installed.

I have never tried a bypass cable on a PE+ myself.  Was Bunker's creation for a PE+ or an S+?

Either way, the whole thing may just be frozen due to the missing leg on the ram chip.  I think that's ultimately the place to start, but if your optics are questionable, it may be time to purchase a pair of those, too.

[Kid Smack]

Well...It's been awhile. I ordered a new SRAM chip thinking it would be the right one, but it wasn't the right size. Ordered from a different company and got the one I needed. So the new chip is in place. It had no effect on the machine. The screen is still stuck as it is in the pic above. (Call Attendent, Door Open, CMOS Data) If I push and/or hold the test switch, nothing happens. The reset key does nothing either.  So...Originally there was just a hopper jam, which was fixed. But when my buddy closed the door, it didn't reset. It didn't do anything. At that point, the test switch had no effect on the machine. Holding it did nothing and the reset switch did nothing either. He ordered used optics off Ebay and when I put them in, one of the wires just fell off the emitter so I'm fairly certain they were bad to start with. He will be ordering new door optics tonight from either Happ or SlotMachinesLTD.com so again we'll be waiting for parts. As stated earlier, when he fixed the hopper jam, the test switch didn't do anything. Does anyone have an idea where to start checking around from that point while I wait for the door optics?

[knagl]

Avoid ordering from Happ if you can help it at all (and you can -- there are many vendors here who can get you the optics you need).  Happ will hit you with their famous Mystery Shipping© which can more than double the cost of the part you order.

If the machine isn't responding to the switch, either the switch (or its wiring) is bad, or there's a problem with the MPU board.  Do you have a spare MPU board you can put in there to try?  Otherwise, I'd take a continuity meter to the contacts on the back of the switch to make sure that it's working, and also trace the wiring down to the motherboard to make sure its all connected firmly and not cut anywhere.  Even with your hopper jam situation, the test switch should have brought you through the various setup pages.

You might want to inspect the removable MPU board (turn the power off before removing or inserting the board) to see if there is anything visibly burnt or broken on it.

Honestly, you may want to contact one of the vendors and order a MPU board and a set of optics to cover all the bases.


Edit: Also, where are you located?  It's always possible that there's another member nearby who may have spare parts and knowledge to help you in person.

[Kid Smack]

Thanks for the info on Happ. That was the first choice since they rebuilt a few monitors for some old Sigma machines for us in the past. ($300, and I don't think they do it anymore, if anyone's interested.)

I don't have a spare MPU board. I've checked the wiring a few times already and haven't seen anything so far. I'll check over it all again. I'll have to also check out the switch. I see the switch is a 1 amp 124 VAC. If it is faulty, will a 3 amp 125 VAC such as this one work: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062542&filterName=Type&filterValue=SPDT# HAPP (for reference) wants $20 for the original, haven't looked elsewhere yet.

Hopefully I can check the switch tomorrow or Friday. The machine is in Kimberly, WI. My buddy put an ad on C/L today looking for a slot tech.

[Buzz]

 go to Radio Shack and get a momentary on switch or take a small screw driver or wire and jump across the post on your switch. slant top is easy to get to. When you get your new optics one thing to watch for, on the door latch one piece rotates CW to allow you to pull up on the belly door latch. that same piece MUST be rotated CCW for the optics to see each other. The belly door must be installed to test the machine. If and I say if you didn't do all this, the first set of optics may be good. I have had every errors you have and I cleared everyone with the white button and the jackpot key, never a prom change. How I did it I don't know, push a button turn a key all I know the errors is gone!!

[Kid Smack]

Update...Haven't been on here in awhile, haven't had much time to work on it at all. My buddy ordered new door optics and a used MPU. I'll let you all know what I find out after he gets them. Thanks again for all the help so far.

[Kid Smack]

Well, my buddy called me tonight and the MPU came in. I went over and put it in and it works fine, no errors. Only two minor problems. First, it only takes quarters, no bills (like the DBV is not present). In the test menus there is a screen that read something like "bill validator can only be enabled through..." not sure off hand, I believe it said some chip. Does anyone know how to enable it? Second, the new board has only one game, as compared to the five game selections in the original board. How many chips would need to be switched to put the five games on the new board? Both have the MRO, MGO, etc. graphic chips. They are however different part numbers on both boards and I also noticed they were in different positions, as in MRO chip on one board in MGO position on other board. Could the game chip and data chip just be swapped or do I need to swap the graphic chips as well and if the graphic chips need to be swapped too, should they be inserted in the same slots (MRO in U77, etc.) as they are on the original board?

The original board has game chip: XMP00006, and data chip: XM00002P
New board has game chip: XP000104, and data chip: X000726
Again, I don't have the numbers off the graphic chips, but they were different.

Very close now, thanks everyone.

[blueridgeslots]

We have the SET chip needed for the PE+ also a Clear chip as well

[knagl]

Glad to hear you've got the machine back to life.

To change back to the multi game set, remove and swap the game, data, mro, mgo, mbo, mxo, and CAP chips.  Try not to break any of the legs off. 

If the boards aren't the same revision and have the chip sockets in different places, pay attention to the labeling (mro, mbo, etc.) and not the Uxx numbers.  MRO will always be MRO.  U77 may not be the same with different design boards.

You'll get a data error screen after the swap -- that's normal.  Use combinations of holding the self test button until it dings, and closing the door and turning the JP reset key to get it working after the game change.

The procedure for enabling the validator can be found here:
http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=2078.msg16174#msg16174

If you don't have the chip, Jim who posted above me is a great person to work with -- he can get you the validator SET chip you need.

[Kid Smack]

Ok, cool, that's pretty much what I figured. Just wondering, since the validator was enabled on the original board, would that info still be stored in the program chip, thus by swapping all the chips it would still be enabled or would I still need the set chip? Also, I see that the CAP chip isn't labeled like I see in other posts. Which one might it be? From looking at the board I get a bad feeling that would require soldering.

EDIT: Looked in the manual. Found it. U43. No soldering.