S+ Accounts

[asgard]

I have a S+ slot machine that has an accounting problem, the soft and hard meters won't correspond. I know the hard meters are correct but why are the soft meters coming up short ? This applies especially to the credit out meter reading.

[stayouttadabunker]

How MUCH short? 1 or 2 credits? 100 or 200 credits?
That will make a world of difference when trying to pinpoint the problem.

[asgard]

Credit IN short by about 1000 credits and credit OUT short by about 8000 credits. It follows this pattern every week I check the machine's accounts. It's so much easier to use the soft meters so I want to get this fixed.

[StatFreak]

Why are you sure that the hard meters are correct?  

It is FAR more likely that they are malfunctioning than it is that the software is not recording the data correctly, unless someone is tampering with the machines. Don't forget that you need to add the soft credit collect and jackpot pays totals to the total coin out. It is also best to take the readings with no credits on the machine, as that can make things more difficult to reconcile.

[asgard]

^^Well if I go off the soft meter readings the machine is going to show a "unrealistic" figure eg. credit IN = 9050 and credit OUT = 913, I operate at 90% payout. When I check the hard meters I get something more "realistic" eg. credit IN = 10050 and credit OUT = 8912. Jackpots are cleared and recorded manually.

[stayouttadabunker]

I'd change the mechanical hard credit meters to the digital dual
readout "IN & OUT" LCD displays with the optional resettable counters.
I had about 10 of these installed in machines and never looked back at a mechanical meter again.
Ask them for the resettable ones...that way you can totally start from zero every week!
Just don't let anyone else into the door or machine!
Or install it in another locked box if you have to!
Best thing about it...NO MOVING PARTS!!! and it keeps it's memory in case of power outages!!!

http://cgi.ebay.com/CH-7-digits-LCD-coin-Counter-arcade-slot-machine_W0QQitemZ250593768739QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3a588d7523

[asgard]

I don't think the hard meters are the problem, I think I'll just change the CPU board and see what happens. I'll keep you guys posted. Thanks.

[stayouttadabunker]

Did you add the "hand-pays" to the soft "OUT" count?

[asgard]

Doesn't matter because the hard meters don't record hand pays either (I just use IN and OUT). Hand pays are recorded and cleared manually. The only way a hard meter can malfunction is to stick (get stuck) so if the soft meters accounts showed more I would understand but it is the hard meter readings that are more so all I can think of is some glitch with the CPU board.

[stayouttadabunker]

The signal for the "out" might be incorrectly configured and is being
multiplied or putting out signals to the meter in pennies rather than dollar amounts.
I've seen this happen the other way around when the "In" was
programmed like 4 or 5 "pulses" per credit.
Your "out" meter is probably hooked up to the ticket printer?

[asgard]

Had the machine on location working perfectly for at least 7 years, this problem developed about two months ago.

[StatFreak]

^^Well if I go off the soft meter readings the machine is going to show a "unrealistic" figure eg. credit IN = 9050 and credit OUT = 913, I operate at 90% payout. When I check the hard meters I get something more "realistic" eg. credit IN = 10050 and credit OUT = 8912. Jackpots are cleared and recorded manually.

Regardless of whether or not jackpots are recorded manually, the soft credit collects will count to the mechanical meter and need to be added in. In addition, the jackpots paid meter readings should be checked against your manually recorded data to verify accuracy, and those amounts must be counted when looking at your overall payout.

I know that this is silly, but are you sure that you are recording and transferring the prior meter values correctly in your accounting books or software, since you have to subtract the current value from the previously read value to get the difference? Is it possible that it's human error?

Doesn't matter because the hard meters don't record hand pays either (I just use IN and OUT). Hand pays are recorded and cleared manually. The only way a hard meter can malfunction is to stick (get stuck) so if the soft meters accounts showed more I would understand but it is the hard meter readings that are more so all I can think of is some glitch with the CPU board.

That's not necessarily true. I've seen a mechanical meter malfunction by counting extra numbers.

Have you tried a complete clear just in case the RAM has become corrupted? If you still suspect the computer side of the equation, I would try that before changing the board. If a hardware change turns out to be necessary, don't overlook the EEPROM on the motherboard.

[TZtech]

Hi

Are you the only one with acess to the machine ? Have you been having any CMOS errors on the mach? .When you clear a CMOS error the meters revert to the last saved value in the EEPROM. This is only updated every 100 spins so you may potentially lose up to 99 games worth of data every time an error occurs.

Check the battery and maybe try a Ramclear before replacing the board.

Ian

[StatFreak]

...
Have you tried a complete clear just in case the RAM has become corrupted? If you still suspect the computer side of the equation, I would try that before changing the board. If a hardware change turns out to be necessary, don't overlook the EEPROM on the motherboard.

Hi

Are you the only one with acess to the machine ? Have you been having any CMOS errors on the mach? .When you clear a CMOS error the meters revert to the last saved value in the EEPROM. This is only updated every 100 spins so you may potentially lose up to 99 games worth of data every time an error occurs.

Check the battery and maybe try a Ramclear before replacing the board.

Ian

 

[TZtech]

Hey Stat

Sorry about duplicating your advice     - Will teach me to read all replies next time 

ASGARD - Also bear in mind that different versions of base SW may handle accounting differently. Have any changes been made to the machine recently ?

Ian

[StatFreak]

Hey Stat

Sorry about duplicating your advice     - Will teach me to read all replies next time 

ASGARD - Also bear in mind that different versions of base SW may handle accounting differently. Have any changes been made to the machine recently ?

Ian

Actually, I replied because you had added the possibility of the CMOS to EEPROM info and because I wanted to emphasize that these were the most likely causes and course of action that Asgard should pursue.

You've also added another good point. (So now it's my turn to aplologize for restating your points. ) Since the newer and older versions of SP chips don't display the same data in the same order, someone mechanically "going down the list" of book values and manually recording them into a pre-made data sheet would be putting the wrong info in the wrong spot if the chip had been changed.


<ADD> I am also still pondering the possibility that an employee has figured out a way to screw up the books intentionally so that he/she can steal.

[asgard]

I'd change the mechanical hard credit meters to the digital dual
readout "IN & OUT" LCD displays with the optional resettable counters.
I had about 10 of these installed in machines and never looked back at a mechanical meter again.
Ask them for the resettable ones...that way you can totally start from zero every week!
Just don't let anyone else into the door or machine!
Or install it in another locked box if you have to!
Best thing about it...NO MOVING PARTS!!! and it keeps it's memory in case of power outages!!!

http://cgi.ebay.com/CH-7-digits-LCD-coin-Counter-arcade-slot-machine_W0QQitemZ250593768739QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3a588d7523

Are those meters compatible with the IGT S+ machines ?

[stayouttadabunker]

For the "In" - You need to find a 12VDC source
in the machine and use the coin-in meter signal
pulse from the motherboard's number 7B pin on the P2 header connector.

For the "Out" - You can use the coin-out meter signal
pulse from the motherboard's number 6B pin
on the P2 header connector.

Both meter signals are just tapped into their respective wires
back to the meter to increment the "in" and "Out" counters.

[asgard]

Thanks !