Igt S2000 sound problem - humming and static

[StatFreak]

Here is a brief summary of this common problem and some pictures that help illustrate the solution. Note that there is a picture of the 47k resistor in-line with one of the speakers. This is actually the place to put the 10k pots (potentiometer) if they are what is needed. The 47k resistor would be used on a Vision as described by idesign.

Thanks to idesign and DJH for their solutions and to mowtiss for starting the thread.

Note that these posts are not in the order originally posted.

« Reply #81 on: April 30, 2007, 06:07:58 AM »

I just got back from Atlantic City this weekend.   All the S2000 machines that I played that had enhanced sound and especially backlit reels had sound problems (severe hum).  It's not that apparent during the normal hours when the casino is filled with lots of players since the ambient noise level is pretty high.   Yesterday morning the casino was pretty empty and the hum was very apparent in these machines.

So, the bottem line is that it's normal for the S2000 to have this annoying hum if it has a multimedia lit board and especially if it has backlit reels too.

For the home user the fix is to use a 10K pot on each speaker if you have stereo sound or if you have mono sound a single 10K pot will work depending upon how your machine is wired.  If you have a Vision machine, a 47K resistor on the output side of the LCD will quiet the hum down.

Oh, and yes, I came back with some of their money for a change. 

NOTE: It has been stated by many that the best sound is achieved with a volume of 6 or 7 on the machine. If one uses the 10k pots it is best to set the level in the menus first and then adjust the pots for the desired volume to get the lowest signal to noise ratio.

You need to use 1/2 watt or better components. A 1/4 watt pot or resistor will burn out.


« Reply #82 on: April 30, 2007, 08:07:58 AM »

I can confirm that I only noticed the hum with the MML2 boards and sound simm installed.  I think they boost the audio output to let everyone hear their 1990 sounds!   Out of about 20 S2000/Visions I have worked in the last 6 months all of them get the hum with the MML2 board / Simm installed.   So the 10k pot is the trick to lower the audio output.  The same reason I disconnect the audio amp board but the 10k put is the trick.   I am sure that IGT would have to go through a huge process to introduce the same fix for little ROI.

[StatFreak]

« Reply #30 on: April 25, 2007, 10:51:08 PM »
DJH

For all folks who get an S2000 with the MML2 board and sound simm you are going to have hum unless you do the 47k mod which I have started to install on all games.    The sub speaker is connected I know that for sure.   The upper amp board is not needed and it's only an inline AMP and has nothing to do with making the game stereo.   The S2000 games before 2003 did not come setup for stereo only mono but can be changed to stereo just by setting it up like the late model. 

See the pictures, the first is an s2000 from 2003 and the last picture is the connector from the 2000 model.   They changed around everything and went full stereo  sometime in late 2002.   The last picture is of the connector that mowtisss has which is mono from the factory (they feed the bottom speaker off the top which is mono from the start).  The splice was done to rewire the bottom speaker which is looped from the audio amp.  The audio amp (older style) just adds more hum and noise, the 47k inline resistor and or using a 10k trim pot does the trick.  Lowers the over driven output from sound level 1.  You are just turning down the audio below level 1 which gets rid of the hum and raising it from the system with the actual audio up. 

The funny part is if you don't install the SIMM the hum goes away. When the MML2 board is active with the SIMM (it's not when there is no simm installed) the audio level is normal.   I think they wanted to boost the improved sounds in a casino without having to ask the techs to raise it etc.   


Karma to idesign for figuring it out.

[StatFreak]

« Reply #31 on: April 25, 2007, 11:03:29 PM »

So do i put the 47k resistors on the white wires. ? inbetween the wire from the speaker the the next plug?

« Reply #32 on: April 25, 2007, 11:10:04 PM »

Yes

White wire that goes to the speaker, just set it up as an inline splice.   

You can wire the left and and right speaker as stereo but I see little benefit as the sound seams 100% the same. 

« Reply #36 on: April 26, 2007, 04:43:35 AM »

The audio amp does make a difference if you add the LCD to an S2000 and upgrade it to a Vision.  The stereo sound is outstanding as it is generated by the sound files in the flash card in the LCD. 

[StatFreak]

« Reply #41 on: April 26, 2007, 02:46:17 PM »

Cut the wire where the red arrow is and wire the resistor in-line for each speaker.

[StatFreak]

« Reply #45 on: April 26, 2007, 02:50:26 PM »

here is how im doing it i haven't connected them with all the stuff yet just quickly so i can show you..

« Reply #46 on: April 26, 2007, 02:54:16 PM »

Looks correct to me.  And when you connect the wires again you do get sound out of the machine?  and that is a 47K resistor?

NOTE: This is the correct location for the splice but with an S2000 without the Vision or an audio amp, a 10k pot is needed here, NOT a 47k resistor. This should be done for both speakers. Mowtiss ended up replacing these resistors with pots to solve his problem.

[StatFreak]

Here is some more discussion from another thread regarding machines with amps.

Re: IGT S2000 Newbie Questions
« Reply #40 on: January 16, 2008, 03:54:31 PM »

If you do it [add the pot or resistor] after the amp you risk blowing the amp so be careful.  Also if after the amp then each speaker needs a pot or resistor.

Re: IGT S2000 Newbie Questions
« Reply #41 on: January 16, 2008, 03:59:41 PM »

Yep one for each speaker,  now I have never blown an amp or heard of that until this thread?    Are you saying that lowering the output to to speaker would cause it to blow?  I would think it's one way?  I can understand if you over drive your amp inbound (coming from the machine) but why output limiting?   How does that dirve up the impedance unless you add speakers?   

[StatFreak]

Re: IGT S2000 Newbie Questions
« Reply #43 on: January 16, 2008, 04:14:54 PM »

The amp is not that well designed to handle the additional load.  It already has limiting resistors on the board by way of jumpers to match the impedance to the speakers.  Adding resistors or pots messes up the match.  I discovered that when you add them after the amp the components on the board are a lot hotter than than without them.  All this heat will shorten the life of the components on the board.  Do it at you own risk. 

[StatFreak]

Re: IGT S2000 Newbie Questions
« Reply #46 on: January 16, 2008, 07:28:42 PM »

Just to note that a volume pot or VR is really the same thing as resistor in theory.  The real question to solve would be does it make a difference if you resist the volume before it gets there or after.  You can put the VR before the amp but balanacing would be an issue.   Running hotter does not always mean that a failure would be sooner and or bad for the board.  I still have not seen a blown AMP yet or heard of one.   I like the VR becasue when I change games or themes or even boards I find that a static resistor value needs change. 

Just my 2 cents

[brian123dff]

I had the same problem with my S2000 and the sound humming from the LEFT speaker only, I followed IGT CN 3633 and it solved the problem!

Disclaimer: Good soldering skills with a sharp tip is a great help, delicate soldering of the MPU is required!

Please be advised the modification only requires to MPU P/N 75510502 Rev A and 75510504 Rev A. Raw boards 75510504 Rev B and 75510530 Rev C will not require this work. These changes have been incorporated into the artwork.

- Remove R26 on the backside of the MPU
- Lift pin 4 of U43 and clip close to the chip (tricky!)
- Hook up 24ga wire between U85 pin 5 and C70 pin 1
- Hook up 24ga wire between U85 pin 4 to C57 pin 1
- Hook up 24ga wire between C70 pin 1, J1 pin 18b
- Hook up 24ga wire between J1 pin 14a, C61 pin 2, and C70 pin 2
- Hook up 24ga wire between J4 pin 22a, J4 pin 22c, and J1 pin 14b

My machine has the multimedia board and also has amplified speakers, it worked on my machine. If your machine is anything different be cautious!

[Bettor Slots]

I used the 47 Ohm Resistor modification as suggested with great success, but also along the way learned some things that I wanted to share that may be helpful.  As part of this post I want to suggest the possibility that those that have made this modification may still not be receiving full or correct sound.

The Story:

I recently refurbished a total of (8) eight S-2000 machines.  These machines did not all come from the same casino, in fact, 3 different casinos, as far north as Canada and as far south as Tunica.  Most of these machines were standard games with Legacy sound that were not taking full advantage of the S2000’s sound capabilities.

I converted them all to games themes that made full use of the S2000's sound capabilities, like Tabasco, Wild Thing Black Leather, Cigar, Chainsaws & Toasters, Munster's, Phantom of the Opera, Genie, and Wild Thing Cigar.  To each machine I added a MMlite Sound Expansion card and of course the required Sound Enhancement Simm. 

And, exactly as reported in this thread above, each machine once powered back up had a whiny, humming noises coming from the top speakers.  This was more than just annoying and really distracted from the games sound. 

So, just like suggested, I added a 1/2 watt, 47 ohm, resistor, picked up at my local Radio Shack for only 20 cents apiece, to each of the top box speakers.  Like magic the sound distortion was gone.  I increased the sound volume to “7â€� and what a huge improvement…of course I was thrilled as I could now hear perfectly the stereo sound coming out of the top box speakers.

An Interesting Find:

You ever hear that saying “that some of the greatest inventions in our time came by total accident�?

Now by the time I got to my 5th machine, which happened to be a Chainsaws and Toasters, something different happened.  After I made the modification in the top box and powered the machine back on, the sound from the bottom base speaker was extremely loud….thump, thump, thump…and completely over powered the higher tone sounds coming from the top box satellite speakers.  Something was just not right here.

Odd…so the first thing I did was go back to the first 4 machines that I thought were “successfulâ€�, and put my ear down by the bass speaker.  What I discovered was that no sound at all was coming from this speaker.

The second thing I did was PM one the posters above to this thread to see if they ever had this problem to any of their machines….the answer came back “nopeâ€�.  While I waited for this response I went back and finished the 3 remaining machines.  They all seemed perfect and no loud thump, thump sound coming from the base speaker.  And, like the first 4 machines, when putting my ear down to the bass speaker, there was no sound coming from the bass speakers at all.  So this was a real head scratcher at first.   

I went back to the Chainsaws and Toasters and decided to use some logic.  If the top 2 speakers were receiving too amplified of a signal originally that needed to be resisted, then why would this not be true of the bass speaker as well?  So what the heck, speaker wire is cheap, I clipped the bass speaker wire and added a resistor to it as well.  See the first photo below of the resistor added to the white wire of the base speaker.

WOW, incredible results, as the sound now completely balanced out between the higher pitched tones coming from the top box and the bass tones coming from the bottom tray bass speaker.  Now this is what IGT had intended us to hear…great stereo sound with a balanced blend of heart pounding thumps occasionally coming from the bass trays speaker!!!  And this is proof positive that a resistor is needed on that wire as well.

AND, now I had to ask “why was I not getting this great sound from the other 7 machinesâ€�?  Although the humming squeaky sounds were gone and the high pitched sounds from the top speakers were great, there was no great bass or any sound coming from the tray speakers on those machines….dang it!!

After some messing around and trying some different things I discovered that the bass speaker was not making a good or full connection on the 7 other machines.  Study the second picture below.  In my mind this is a poor design by IGT (no surprises here) in that after multiple removals and re-installations of the tray, the plastic Molex connection becomes bent and distorted.  So even though it seems as though the tray is fully seated when you reinstall and close your machine, it is actually about a 1/8â€� higher than it should be….impossible to really notice this…but I really believe this is the case.  7 of the 8 machines just shopped, all from different casinos, all had this issue.  It was just total luck that the Chainsaws machine was seating properly as intended which is why I received the true bass signal on that machine.

(continued next post)

[Bettor Slots]

So try this, as seen in the first photo below, remove the plastic Molex from both the tray AND the bottom of the cabinet.  Then try to fully seat it.  I found in all cases that it would not fully seat and for sure was not receiving full signal.  I also found that I had to use a small X-acto knife to clean up the female Molex as the plastic had bent and folded in not allowing for a fully seated connection.  Further, I had to use some needle nose pliers to straighten out and return to proper shape the male Molex before I could make a good connection.
Be careful, as shown in the second photo below, as you reinstall the tray, balance it on your lap, so you can use your free hand to keep the speaker wire pushed out of the way so that it does not get pinched.  Also be careful the next time you remove your tray as this connection is no longer anchored down.
Results!!!  Incredible sound now, once the resistors are installed on all 3 speakers, and proper connection is made at the bass speaker location.  Sounds I have never heard before…both Wild Things sound like a rock concert, the Chainsaw’s was truly addictive, and Phantom was eerie with the “moohaha’sâ€� that you feel in your chest. 

Summary:

Any S2000 machine with the MMlite sound enhancement card and sound simm will definitely benefit from the installation of 1/2 watt, 47 ohm, resistors added to the white speaker wires at all 3 speaker locations.  Check you bass speaker connection as it is very likely not fully seated, not receiving full or any signal.  Finally, if you have made this mod already, and you do have a good bass speaker connection, it is very likely you are receiving too much bass signal, it is overpowering your higher pitched tones coming from the top box speakers and you are missing out on some great balanced sound.

[StatFreak]

Thank you Jim (arch)! I'll bet that a lot of S2000 owners will be thanking you for that post. 

If anyone out there is adventurous enough to try IGT's official fix as posted by brian123dff, please post back and let everyone know how that went.
brian123dff, thank you as well for your post. 

K+ all around.

Stat 

[stayouttadabunker]

That is a really good post Jim
I love when guys "tinker" with their machines!
I'm not surprised you found great results because of it!

[Karaoke Mike]

I feel really stupid, but where do you put the resisters on the S2000 vision? Thank you

[Bettor Slots]

There are 3 locations where you find white wires that need to be cut, strip a half inch off each end, and then twist tightly onto the resistors.  Do not cut the wrong wire because you will immediately see and hear a count down on your LED display and your machine will self destruct exactly 10 seconds afterwards. 

First location is you base tray speaker.  Remove your tray and hopper and then find the white and green wire coming from the back of your machine to the Molex holder near black coin overflow chute.  See the first picture below and the red arrows.  My advice is that you remove the plastic Molex from the holder completely from the base of the cabinet and also from the back of your coin tray to make sure this connection is fully seated properly.  White wire...not the green one...should be cut, stripped, and resistor attached.

The second two locations are in your top box.  Simply find the white/green wire leading out from your side speakers on the left and right side of your cabinet.  The picture below is not a Vision but will look similar...again red arrows show the location of the wire and where to cut.  White wire...not the green one....should be cut, stripped, and resistor attached.

Good luck.

Jim

[Karaoke Mike]

So, the vision and plain S2000 are in the same location? Use 47k 1/2 watt resisters?

[Bettor Slots]

I just took a look at one of my Vision's and they are in the same location as seen in the first picture below....however, just noticed the wire colors are the same in that case....oops...guess they ran out of green wire that day at the factory.   

So if you do have a condition where the speaker wires are the same color, look closely at the second picture zoomed in....you want to cut the wire that is opposite to the molex clip anchor as shown in that pic.

Hope that helps.

Jim

[Karaoke Mike]

Ok, now I am really lost. I did as you have in the picture and then I get no sound from the speakers. I used the same resisters, same wire location and all. Now I am going crazy.

[jay]

Did you take them out and subsequently did the problem go away or is it still persisting ?

If it goes away something isn't right with what you did

...... If it doesn't go away its a different problem..... Ie wire fell off the speaker connector.

WIthout unsoldering etc. You should just be able to run a jumper wire over the resistor as a test.....

[Karaoke Mike]

I remove the resister and then it works again ,but the same noise.

[Bettor Slots]

If I were a gambling man...which I am not...I hate Casinos and slots....I would bet that prior to the modification in it's over amplified state, your volume is turned way down low...like around "1", so after you make the mod you need to increase your volume up to around a "7" or "8" for me.  In other words, you cannot hear because your volume is still turned down low.

Jim

[Karaoke Mike]

I did 1 speaker removed the other 2 and turned the volume up to 7 and still nothing

[jay]

Sounds like the resistor is dead
Have you taken a multimeter to the resistor ?
You short your meter leads and zero the meter with the little dial assuming its an analog meter.

You should then be able to measure the correct amount of resistance across it.
The the meter doesn't register its a dead one.

If the value is too high you won't be hearing any noise.

[stayouttadabunker]

or backwards?

[jay]

I know my electronics are a bit dated.......Resistors are not uni-directional like diodes ......  unless you mean the wrong wire.