Mini Unidesa 300 reel problem

[Busch]

Hallo there.
I am new here and also new wih Unidesa machines. I have 2 cute mini unidesas slots for ba top. Now 1 gives me the following error:

shows code RED 33, which is according to the manual an easy reel
problem supposed to be solved switching on and off the machine. Well,
it isn't solved that way but stays the same, after switching on, the
3rd reel (closest to the door lock), starts turning like the others,
but then continues stuttering a few centimeters forward every few
seconds. I cleaned all the contacts I could find on the boards,
reconnected them , reset the machine, to no avail, message stays. What
can I do?
Anybody any clue?

I am really desperate cos here in Angola it's a lost case if one would rely on local services!

[paul]

did you try a clear on the machine ok first open the door turn the door lock to the closed posistion on the door now hold down the reset switch and turn machine on when you get action on screen let go of switch and wait till machine resets then open lock and close door and see if machine resets

[Busch]

Thanx Paul for your idea with the door lock, but it seams you have a slightly different machine in mind, cos mine does not have any sensors attached to doorswitch what so ever. So resetting as you said does not make a difference with doorlock closed or not. Unfortunately. After Ido reset the described way, the machine ends up in same tilt status.
Still I have no clues so far.

[Op-Bell]

Stepper motor reels, I presume? On power up the machine turns all the reels looking for the index flag, so it knows where the reel is facing. This sounds like the index flag is not being seen, perhaps because it's fallen off, perhaps because the opto sensor is damaged. The flag is a short flat piece usually clipped on the reel edge, the sensor is a PI- shaped thing (T with 2 legs, like TT), the flag passes between the sensor legs. Compare the other reels. If the reel doesn't turn smoothly like the others it's probably that one of its 4 coils is out, perhaps a broken wire or bad contact. This could look like an index problem because it will miss steps and take too long to get to the index position. An actual motor failure is quite uncommon.

[SAT (aka GANDHI)]

Stepper motor reels, I presume? On power up the machine turns all the reels looking for the index flag, so it knows where the reel is facing. This sounds like the index flag is not being seen, perhaps because it's fallen off, perhaps because the opto sensor is damaged. The flag is a short flat piece usually clipped on the reel edge, the sensor is a PI- shaped thing (T with 2 legs, like TT), the flag passes between the sensor legs. Compare the other reels. If the reel doesn't turn smoothly like the others it's probably that one of its 4 coils is out, perhaps a broken wire or bad contact. This could look like an index problem because it will miss steps and take too long to get to the index position. An actual motor failure is quite uncommon.

Exactly!!!   

That error and the behavior the machine is giving you is because the fault Op-Bell described in his post.  Look for the plastic flag attached to the plastic reel itself.  It´s probably broken or not even there.  The short steps that reel performs every 2 secs is about the the slot machine looking to sync the reel´s position.

Just a Note: In case you don´t find the plastic flag in the other reels in order to compare with the bad one, some reels used by Unidesa wear a little magnet in a form of a small cylinder, also attached to the reel´s body.  The sensor on the reel´s board is also different for this arrange of course:  not an optic sensor but a magnetic one.

Don´t think the stepper motor is the problem here neither.

Old reels are commonly broken without you notice about it (specially Unidesa´s)

Best regards and good luck

[Busch]

Thank you SAT  and OP-Bell,
I opened the complicated reel-ribbon box in the door of the machine, one has to remove the PCB first, the mechanism you explain is slightly different.
1. The "reel" is not a reel but a sort of conveyerbelt with the images on running over 2 cylinders so that from outside the images appear flat. The whole thing is inside a closed plastic cassette.
2. On 1 side of that belt are obviously magnetic stripes of app. 1cm in length and interrupted by 1 cm all around the belt.
3. That magnetised  part runs through a obviously also magnetic sensor of that greek PI shape to give a certain signal to the attached small electronic board.
That's how it looks to me.
Now I opened all and everything, all contacts on board whatsoever, replaced it, same problem.
My guess is either the magnetic information on that reelbelts are worn out or there is a problem on the board somewhere which controls the reel no.1, or both??
Question is:
Can I to check where the fault is, swap that "reelboxes" ( there are 3 of them, all look similar) to see whether the fault is there or in the electronic somewhere else?
Can I swap eproms which are obviously allocated to the different reel positions to see if the problem is there?
Can I damage more when swapping/interchanging these parts?
I think in principle it works pretty much the same as you described, only there is not only 1 device along the reel giving the impuls and can't get lost cos it's an integral part of the reelbelt
If I find the problem where could I possibly find replacements?

Thanx alot,
I am still hopeful with that machine, it is very small and cute, aaeh, cute if it is working that is...

[SAT (aka GANDHI)]

Thank you SAT  and OP-Bell,
I opened the complicated reel-ribbon box in the door of the machine, one has to remove the PCB first, the mechanism you explain is slightly different.
1. The "reel" is not a reel but a sort of conveyerbelt with the images on running over 2 cylinders so that from outside the images appear flat. The whole thing is inside a closed plastic cassette.

First time i heard about such a machine...   

POST SOME PICTURES!!!

Can I to check where the fault is, swap that "reelboxes" ( there are 3 of them, all look similar) to see whether the fault is there or in the electronic somewhere else?
Can I swap eproms which are obviously allocated to the different reel positions to see if the problem is there?
Can I damage more when swapping/interchanging these parts?

For discard purpose I would do both actions.  As soon as you don´t put the eproms backwards (wrong polarity) nothing will get burned.  In case there is "something" associated to each "reelbox" more than the plastic strips the worse case would be you getting a "mismatch error" or something like that.....    As i said:  I would do it 

If I find the problem where could I possibly find replacements?

Here I can´t help you my friend... I worked directly with the manufacturer so it was pretty easy for me to find parts, but out of the house i really don´t know.

[Op-Bell]

1. The "reel" is not a reel but a sort of conveyerbelt with the images on running over 2 cylinders so that from outside the images appear flat.

That would be one of these, then - Starpoint makes two or three different styles, this is the smallest, and I know Unidesa uses Starpoint. Suzo-Happ is the US distributor.

[SAT (aka GANDHI)]

As usual OP-Bell illustrating us.  Thanks for that picture sir   

There you have Busch what you wanted to know 

Cheers

[Busch]

Hi again and thanks for the information.
I swapped the position of the reel-boxes (looks similar to the 1 on the pic, but not quite, is probably an older version), and the problem is not with the reel-bx itself, cos then the other reel-box did the same.
So I swapped the 2 big eproms on the right side of pic, cos  I think they r responsible for the reel-movement??, but the machine gives me tilt "RED 30", and I changed back again.
So all I know the problem is most likely somewhere on that board (see picture). Any ideas how I could find out what piece is the one I would most welcome.
Maybe is another eprom or sth. else.

[Busch]

And here a pic from outside.
I never saw it somewhere else myself, and the Unidesa WEB page does not mention it either.
Strange